Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

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Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

nicolas chavent

Hi all, 

Below is the English translation of an email sent first to the hot-francophone mailing list. It focuses on the first crowdfunding 100% directed to OpenStreetMap in Western Africa. The project is run by the local OSM association (OSM Bénin) with the support of the collective Projet Espace OSM Francophone (ProjetEOF) to purchase 275km² high resolution imagery over Cotonou, Benin economic capital.

Enjoy the read and shall you be interested, join us! The crowfunding closes May1, 2016: in 7 days, we still have to raise 550 Euros (25%). This is an easy mean to make a big difference and have a huge OpenStreetMap and opendata impact in Cotonou and Benin by helping significatively the mapping of Cotonou by the Cotonou mappers who can then be supported remotely by the global OSM community and the Western African groups in the first place.  

Best,

Nicolas on the behalf of the Association OSM Bénin et the collective ProjetEOF


= Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016! =

Hi all, 

This crowdfunding "Imagerie Satellite pour OSM Benin" ([1],[2]) is lead by the Association OpenStreetMap Bénin (OSMBénin) [3] with the support of the collective Projet Espace OpenStreetMap Francophone (ProjetEOF) [4]. It aims at purchasing around 275 km² high resolution imagery over Cotonou in a license which allows for creating into OpenStreetMap geographical information  about building, road network, hydrography and landuse.

The mappers from Benin are active creating geographical data in OpenStreetMap and thus improving the Free Map of this World via mapathons [5] field data collections [6], as well as conducting information and outreach work tied to heavy training in GIS (QGIS) and mapping with OSM [7]. Unfortunately they are missing on Cotonou high resolution imagery via the Bing and MapBox layers. This forces the Benin OSM community to map Cotonou - Benin economic capital - through field surveys only (GPS, Mobile phones and FieldPapers), a long time and money intensive work. This takes us back to the early ages of OpenStreetMap prior its members had access to high resolution imagery through agreements with Yahoo, Microsoft Bing or benefited from opendata programs.

Shall this crowdfunding works well, this would be a major breakthrough for the growth of OpenStreetMap in Cotonou and in Benin, as a matter of fact, with this imagery purchased, hosted and accesible:
 - Not only the mappers from Bénin would be more efficient mapping Cotonou and in a position to dedicate more time to non mapping activities such information, outreach, building partnerships while continuing and expanding the activities they had been carrying out in the rest of the country since 2013 as one can read from the "Infolettre OSM Bénin" [8].
 - But for mapping Cotonou, they could benefit from the support of the global OpenStreetMap community and specifically the Western African local groups with whom strong relations have been established and numerous joint mapping activities have been organized since 2013.
 
The crowfunding closes in 7 days, we still have to raise 550 Euros (25%), an easy mean to make a big difference and have a huge OpenStreetMap and opendata impact by helping significatively the mapping of Cotonou by the Cotonou mappers with the support of the global OSM community and the Western African groups in the first place.  

To check the status of this crowdfunding project, stay tuned to the Ulule platform, the OSM lists, the Wiki site of the OSM project in Bénin, blogs and social media used by ProjetEOF (@ProjetEOF), OSMBénin (@OSMBénin) and other Western African OSM collectives.

Nicolas on the behalf of the Association OSM Bénin and the collective Projet EOF.



--
Nicolas Chavent
Projet OpenStreetMap (OSM)
Projet Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
Mobile (FRA): <a href="tel:%2B33%20%280%296%2052%2040%2078%2020" value="+33652407820" target="_blank">+33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
Mobile (CIV): <a href="tel:%2B225%2078%2012%2076%2099" value="+22578127699" target="_blank">+225 78 12 76 99
Email: [hidden email]
Skype: c_nicolas
Twitter: nicolas_chavent

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

john whelan-2
There seems to be fairly reasonable free mapbox imagery of this area available.  There is a lot of very reasonable African imagery available that has not yet been mapped.

http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/1087 is an example.

Cheerio John

On 25 April 2016 at 10:17, nicolas chavent <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi all, 

Below is the English translation of an email sent first to the hot-francophone mailing list. It focuses on the first crowdfunding 100% directed to OpenStreetMap in Western Africa. The project is run by the local OSM association (OSM Bénin) with the support of the collective Projet Espace OSM Francophone (ProjetEOF) to purchase 275km² high resolution imagery over Cotonou, Benin economic capital.

Enjoy the read and shall you be interested, join us! The crowfunding closes May1, 2016: in 7 days, we still have to raise 550 Euros (25%). This is an easy mean to make a big difference and have a huge OpenStreetMap and opendata impact in Cotonou and Benin by helping significatively the mapping of Cotonou by the Cotonou mappers who can then be supported remotely by the global OSM community and the Western African groups in the first place.  

Best,

Nicolas on the behalf of the Association OSM Bénin et the collective ProjetEOF


= Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016! =

Hi all, 

This crowdfunding "Imagerie Satellite pour OSM Benin" ([1],[2]) is lead by the Association OpenStreetMap Bénin (OSMBénin) [3] with the support of the collective Projet Espace OpenStreetMap Francophone (ProjetEOF) [4]. It aims at purchasing around 275 km² high resolution imagery over Cotonou in a license which allows for creating into OpenStreetMap geographical information  about building, road network, hydrography and landuse.

The mappers from Benin are active creating geographical data in OpenStreetMap and thus improving the Free Map of this World via mapathons [5] field data collections [6], as well as conducting information and outreach work tied to heavy training in GIS (QGIS) and mapping with OSM [7]. Unfortunately they are missing on Cotonou high resolution imagery via the Bing and MapBox layers. This forces the Benin OSM community to map Cotonou - Benin economic capital - through field surveys only (GPS, Mobile phones and FieldPapers), a long time and money intensive work. This takes us back to the early ages of OpenStreetMap prior its members had access to high resolution imagery through agreements with Yahoo, Microsoft Bing or benefited from opendata programs.

Shall this crowdfunding works well, this would be a major breakthrough for the growth of OpenStreetMap in Cotonou and in Benin, as a matter of fact, with this imagery purchased, hosted and accesible:
 - Not only the mappers from Bénin would be more efficient mapping Cotonou and in a position to dedicate more time to non mapping activities such information, outreach, building partnerships while continuing and expanding the activities they had been carrying out in the rest of the country since 2013 as one can read from the "Infolettre OSM Bénin" [8].
 - But for mapping Cotonou, they could benefit from the support of the global OpenStreetMap community and specifically the Western African local groups with whom strong relations have been established and numerous joint mapping activities have been organized since 2013.
 
The crowfunding closes in 7 days, we still have to raise 550 Euros (25%), an easy mean to make a big difference and have a huge OpenStreetMap and opendata impact by helping significatively the mapping of Cotonou by the Cotonou mappers with the support of the global OSM community and the Western African groups in the first place.  

To check the status of this crowdfunding project, stay tuned to the Ulule platform, the OSM lists, the Wiki site of the OSM project in Bénin, blogs and social media used by ProjetEOF (@ProjetEOF), OSMBénin (@OSMBénin) and other Western African OSM collectives.

Nicolas on the behalf of the Association OSM Bénin and the collective Projet EOF.



--
Nicolas Chavent
Projet OpenStreetMap (OSM)
Projet Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
Mobile (FRA): <a href="tel:%2B33%20%280%296%2052%2040%2078%2020" value="+33652407820" target="_blank">+33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
Mobile (CIV): <a href="tel:%2B225%2078%2012%2076%2099" value="+22578127699" target="_blank">+225 78 12 76 99
Email: [hidden email]
Skype: c_nicolas
Twitter: nicolas_chavent

_______________________________________________
talk mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk



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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

althio
John,

You can't blame people for looking for the best imagery around Cotonou, Bénin.
We are talking of the largest city in this country, 700 000+ inhabitants.

I don't find it very reasonable to propose another project 1000 km away.
The local mappers want to map their city, that's all.

Best,

- althio


On 25 April 2016 at 16:31, john whelan <[hidden email]> wrote:

> There seems to be fairly reasonable free mapbox imagery of this area
> available.  There is a lot of very reasonable African imagery available that
> has not yet been mapped.
>
> http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/1087 is an example.
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 25 April 2016 at 10:17, nicolas chavent <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Below is the English translation of an email sent first to the
>> hot-francophone mailing list. It focuses on the first crowdfunding 100%
>> directed to OpenStreetMap in Western Africa. The project is run by the local
>> OSM association (OSM Bénin) with the support of the collective Projet Espace
>> OSM Francophone (ProjetEOF) to purchase 275km² high resolution imagery over
>> Cotonou, Benin economic capital.
>>
>> Enjoy the read and shall you be interested, join us! The crowfunding
>> closes May1, 2016: in 7 days, we still have to raise 550 Euros (25%). This
>> is an easy mean to make a big difference and have a huge OpenStreetMap and
>> opendata impact in Cotonou and Benin by helping significatively the mapping
>> of Cotonou by the Cotonou mappers who can then be supported remotely by the
>> global OSM community and the Western African groups in the first place.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Nicolas on the behalf of the Association OSM Bénin et the collective
>> ProjetEOF
>>
>>
>> = Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution
>> satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016! =
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> This crowdfunding "Imagerie Satellite pour OSM Benin" ([1],[2]) is lead by
>> the Association OpenStreetMap Bénin (OSMBénin) [3] with the support of the
>> collective Projet Espace OpenStreetMap Francophone (ProjetEOF) [4]. It aims
>> at purchasing around 275 km² high resolution imagery over Cotonou in a
>> license which allows for creating into OpenStreetMap geographical
>> information  about building, road network, hydrography and landuse.
>>
>> The mappers from Benin are active creating geographical data in
>> OpenStreetMap and thus improving the Free Map of this World via mapathons
>> [5] field data collections [6], as well as conducting information and
>> outreach work tied to heavy training in GIS (QGIS) and mapping with OSM [7].
>> Unfortunately they are missing on Cotonou high resolution imagery via the
>> Bing and MapBox layers. This forces the Benin OSM community to map Cotonou -
>> Benin economic capital - through field surveys only (GPS, Mobile phones and
>> FieldPapers), a long time and money intensive work. This takes us back to
>> the early ages of OpenStreetMap prior its members had access to high
>> resolution imagery through agreements with Yahoo, Microsoft Bing or
>> benefited from opendata programs.
>>
>> Shall this crowdfunding works well, this would be a major breakthrough for
>> the growth of OpenStreetMap in Cotonou and in Benin, as a matter of fact,
>> with this imagery purchased, hosted and accesible:
>>  - Not only the mappers from Bénin would be more efficient mapping Cotonou
>> and in a position to dedicate more time to non mapping activities such
>> information, outreach, building partnerships while continuing and expanding
>> the activities they had been carrying out in the rest of the country since
>> 2013 as one can read from the "Infolettre OSM Bénin" [8].
>>  - But for mapping Cotonou, they could benefit from the support of the
>> global OpenStreetMap community and specifically the Western African local
>> groups with whom strong relations have been established and numerous joint
>> mapping activities have been organized since 2013.
>>
>> The crowfunding closes in 7 days, we still have to raise 550 Euros (25%),
>> an easy mean to make a big difference and have a huge OpenStreetMap and
>> opendata impact by helping significatively the mapping of Cotonou by the
>> Cotonou mappers with the support of the global OSM community and the Western
>> African groups in the first place.
>>
>> To check the status of this crowdfunding project, stay tuned to the Ulule
>> platform, the OSM lists, the Wiki site of the OSM project in Bénin, blogs
>> and social media used by ProjetEOF (@ProjetEOF), OSMBénin (@OSMBénin) and
>> other Western African OSM collectives.
>>
>> Nicolas on the behalf of the Association OSM Bénin and the collective
>> Projet EOF.
>>
>> [1] : http://fr.ulule.com/imagerie-cotonou/
>> [2] :
>> https://projeteof.org/blog/crowdfunding-openstreetmap-au-benin-275km%C2%B2-dimagerie-satellite-haute-resolution-pour-cotonou-ce-1er-mai-2016/
>> [3] : http://openstreetmap.bj/
>> [4] : https://projeteof.org/blog/projet-eof/
>> [5] : https://twitter.com/absaliou/status/566060712049770496
>> [6] : https://twitter.com/agbadonou/status/719455286285570048
>> [7] : https://twitter.com/agbadonou/status/677513770214801410
>> [8] :
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:SOTMTG-COM-OSMBJ-contenu.pdf
>>
>>
>> --
>> Nicolas Chavent
>> Projet OpenStreetMap (OSM)
>> Projet Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
>> Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
>> Mobile (FRA): +33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
>> Mobile (CIV): +225 78 12 76 99
>> Email: [hidden email]
>> Skype: c_nicolas
>> Twitter: nicolas_chavent
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> talk mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> talk mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

Kevin Bullock
Hi all - I am working with OSM-Benin on behalf of DG to see if we can do something creative; I would rather see this crowdfunding be used for on the ground verification resources.

Best, Kevin Bullock




On 4/25/16, 9:25 AM, "althio" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>John,
>
>You can't blame people for looking for the best imagery around Cotonou, Bénin.
>We are talking of the largest city in this country, 700 000+ inhabitants.
>
>I don't find it very reasonable to propose another project 1000 km away.
>The local mappers want to map their city, that's all.
>
>Best,
>
>- althio
>
>
>On 25 April 2016 at 16:31, john whelan <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> There seems to be fairly reasonable free mapbox imagery of this area
>> available.  There is a lot of very reasonable African imagery available that
>> has not yet been mapped.
>>
>> http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/1087 is an example.
>>
>> Cheerio John
>>
>> On 25 April 2016 at 10:17, nicolas chavent <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> Below is the English translation of an email sent first to the
>>> hot-francophone mailing list. It focuses on the first crowdfunding 100%
>>> directed to OpenStreetMap in Western Africa. The project is run by the local
>>> OSM association (OSM Bénin) with the support of the collective Projet Espace
>>> OSM Francophone (ProjetEOF) to purchase 275km² high resolution imagery over
>>> Cotonou, Benin economic capital.
>>>
>>> Enjoy the read and shall you be interested, join us! The crowfunding
>>> closes May1, 2016: in 7 days, we still have to raise 550 Euros (25%). This
>>> is an easy mean to make a big difference and have a huge OpenStreetMap and
>>> opendata impact in Cotonou and Benin by helping significatively the mapping
>>> of Cotonou by the Cotonou mappers who can then be supported remotely by the
>>> global OSM community and the Western African groups in the first place.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> Nicolas on the behalf of the Association OSM Bénin et the collective
>>> ProjetEOF
>>>
>>>
>>> = Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution
>>> satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016! =
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> This crowdfunding "Imagerie Satellite pour OSM Benin" ([1],[2]) is lead by
>>> the Association OpenStreetMap Bénin (OSMBénin) [3] with the support of the
>>> collective Projet Espace OpenStreetMap Francophone (ProjetEOF) [4]. It aims
>>> at purchasing around 275 km² high resolution imagery over Cotonou in a
>>> license which allows for creating into OpenStreetMap geographical
>>> information  about building, road network, hydrography and landuse.
>>>
>>> The mappers from Benin are active creating geographical data in
>>> OpenStreetMap and thus improving the Free Map of this World via mapathons
>>> [5] field data collections [6], as well as conducting information and
>>> outreach work tied to heavy training in GIS (QGIS) and mapping with OSM [7].
>>> Unfortunately they are missing on Cotonou high resolution imagery via the
>>> Bing and MapBox layers. This forces the Benin OSM community to map Cotonou -
>>> Benin economic capital - through field surveys only (GPS, Mobile phones and
>>> FieldPapers), a long time and money intensive work. This takes us back to
>>> the early ages of OpenStreetMap prior its members had access to high
>>> resolution imagery through agreements with Yahoo, Microsoft Bing or
>>> benefited from opendata programs.
>>>
>>> Shall this crowdfunding works well, this would be a major breakthrough for
>>> the growth of OpenStreetMap in Cotonou and in Benin, as a matter of fact,
>>> with this imagery purchased, hosted and accesible:
>>>  - Not only the mappers from Bénin would be more efficient mapping Cotonou
>>> and in a position to dedicate more time to non mapping activities such
>>> information, outreach, building partnerships while continuing and expanding
>>> the activities they had been carrying out in the rest of the country since
>>> 2013 as one can read from the "Infolettre OSM Bénin" [8].
>>>  - But for mapping Cotonou, they could benefit from the support of the
>>> global OpenStreetMap community and specifically the Western African local
>>> groups with whom strong relations have been established and numerous joint
>>> mapping activities have been organized since 2013.
>>>
>>> The crowfunding closes in 7 days, we still have to raise 550 Euros (25%),
>>> an easy mean to make a big difference and have a huge OpenStreetMap and
>>> opendata impact by helping significatively the mapping of Cotonou by the
>>> Cotonou mappers with the support of the global OSM community and the Western
>>> African groups in the first place.
>>>
>>> To check the status of this crowdfunding project, stay tuned to the Ulule
>>> platform, the OSM lists, the Wiki site of the OSM project in Bénin, blogs
>>> and social media used by ProjetEOF (@ProjetEOF), OSMBénin (@OSMBénin) and
>>> other Western African OSM collectives.
>>>
>>> Nicolas on the behalf of the Association OSM Bénin and the collective
>>> Projet EOF.
>>>
>>> [1] : http://fr.ulule.com/imagerie-cotonou/
>>> [2] :
>>> https://projeteof.org/blog/crowdfunding-openstreetmap-au-benin-275km%C2%B2-dimagerie-satellite-haute-resolution-pour-cotonou-ce-1er-mai-2016/
>>> [3] : http://openstreetmap.bj/
>>> [4] : https://projeteof.org/blog/projet-eof/
>>> [5] : https://twitter.com/absaliou/status/566060712049770496
>>> [6] : https://twitter.com/agbadonou/status/719455286285570048
>>> [7] : https://twitter.com/agbadonou/status/677513770214801410
>>> [8] :
>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:SOTMTG-COM-OSMBJ-contenu.pdf
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Nicolas Chavent
>>> Projet OpenStreetMap (OSM)
>>> Projet Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
>>> Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
>>> Mobile (FRA): +33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
>>> Mobile (CIV): +225 78 12 76 99
>>> Email: [hidden email]
>>> Skype: c_nicolas
>>> Twitter: nicolas_chavent
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> talk mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> talk mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>
>
>_______________________________________________
>talk mailing list
>[hidden email]
>https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

john whelan-2

My thoughts would run along the lines of working with an existing charity to put some feet on the ground and more detail in the maps.  That way the donated dollars go further, crowd sourcing takes a percentage, in Canada there is a 40% tax break on charitable giving so its stretches the available dollars more.

It needs some creative thinking to pull it together.  There are some charities that are now looking at supporting straight infrastructure by local government at a local level and this would seem a natural fit.

Cheerio John
April 25, 2016 11:58 AM
Hi all - I am working with OSM-Benin on behalf of DG to see if we can do something creative; I would rather see this crowdfunding be used for on the ground verification resources.

Best, Kevin Bullock





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April 25, 2016 11:25 AM
John,

You can't blame people for looking for the best imagery around Cotonou, Bénin.
We are talking of the largest city in this country, 700 000+ inhabitants.

I don't find it very reasonable to propose another project 1000 km away.
The local mappers want to map their city, that's all.

Best,

- althio


--
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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

Mikel Maron-3
In reply to this post by Kevin Bullock
That's awesome Kevin. Totally agree, funds can be used for mapping parties and motorcycle fuel! Let me know if Mapbox can help here too, willing to look into it.
 
* Mikel Maron * +14152835207 @mikel s:mikelmaron


On Monday, April 25, 2016 12:01 PM, Kevin Bullock <[hidden email]> wrote:


Hi all - I am working with OSM-Benin on behalf of DG to see if we can do something creative; I would rather see this crowdfunding be used for on the ground verification resources.

Best, Kevin Bullock




On 4/25/16, 9:25 AM, "althio" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>John,
>
>You can't blame people for looking for the best imagery around Cotonou, Bénin.
>We are talking of the largest city in this country, 700 000+ inhabitants.
>
>I don't find it very reasonable to propose another project 1000 km away.
>The local mappers want to map their city, that's all.
>
>Best,
>
>- althio
>
>
>On 25 April 2016 at 16:31, john whelan <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> There seems to be fairly reasonable free mapbox imagery of this area
>> available.  There is a lot of very reasonable African imagery available that
>> has not yet been mapped.
>>
>> http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/1087 is an example.
>>
>> Cheerio John
>>
>> On 25 April 2016 at 10:17, nicolas chavent <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> Below is the English translation of an email sent first to the
>>> hot-francophone mailing list. It focuses on the first crowdfunding 100%
>>> directed to OpenStreetMap in Western Africa. The project is run by the local
>>> OSM association (OSM Bénin) with the support of the collective Projet Espace
>>> OSM Francophone (ProjetEOF) to purchase 275km² high resolution imagery over
>>> Cotonou, Benin economic capital.
>>>
>>> Enjoy the read and shall you be interested, join us! The crowfunding
>>> closes May1, 2016: in 7 days, we still have to raise 550 Euros (25%). This
>>> is an easy mean to make a big difference and have a huge OpenStreetMap and
>>> opendata impact in Cotonou and Benin by helping significatively the mapping
>>> of Cotonou by the Cotonou mappers who can then be supported remotely by the
>>> global OSM community and the Western African groups in the first place.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> Nicolas on the behalf of the Association OSM Bénin et the collective
>>> ProjetEOF
>>>
>>>
>>> = Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution
>>> satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016! =
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> This crowdfunding "Imagerie Satellite pour OSM Benin" ([1],[2]) is lead by
>>> the Association OpenStreetMap Bénin (OSMBénin) [3] with the support of the
>>> collective Projet Espace OpenStreetMap Francophone (ProjetEOF) [4]. It aims
>>> at purchasing around 275 km² high resolution imagery over Cotonou in a
>>> license which allows for creating into OpenStreetMap geographical
>>> information  about building, road network, hydrography and landuse.
>>>
>>> The mappers from Benin are active creating geographical data in
>>> OpenStreetMap and thus improving the Free Map of this World via mapathons
>>> [5] field data collections [6], as well as conducting information and
>>> outreach work tied to heavy training in GIS (QGIS) and mapping with OSM [7].
>>> Unfortunately they are missing on Cotonou high resolution imagery via the
>>> Bing and MapBox layers. This forces the Benin OSM community to map Cotonou -
>>> Benin economic capital - through field surveys only (GPS, Mobile phones and
>>> FieldPapers), a long time and money intensive work. This takes us back to
>>> the early ages of OpenStreetMap prior its members had access to high
>>> resolution imagery through agreements with Yahoo, Microsoft Bing or
>>> benefited from opendata programs.
>>>
>>> Shall this crowdfunding works well, this would be a major breakthrough for
>>> the growth of OpenStreetMap in Cotonou and in Benin, as a matter of fact,
>>> with this imagery purchased, hosted and accesible:
>>>  - Not only the mappers from Bénin would be more efficient mapping Cotonou
>>> and in a position to dedicate more time to non mapping activities such
>>> information, outreach, building partnerships while continuing and expanding
>>> the activities they had been carrying out in the rest of the country since
>>> 2013 as one can read from the "Infolettre OSM Bénin" [8].
>>>  - But for mapping Cotonou, they could benefit from the support of the
>>> global OpenStreetMap community and specifically the Western African local
>>> groups with whom strong relations have been established and numerous joint
>>> mapping activities have been organized since 2013.
>>>
>>> The crowfunding closes in 7 days, we still have to raise 550 Euros (25%),
>>> an easy mean to make a big difference and have a huge OpenStreetMap and
>>> opendata impact by helping significatively the mapping of Cotonou by the
>>> Cotonou mappers with the support of the global OSM community and the Western
>>> African groups in the first place.
>>>
>>> To check the status of this crowdfunding project, stay tuned to the Ulule
>>> platform, the OSM lists, the Wiki site of the OSM project in Bénin, blogs
>>> and social media used by ProjetEOF (@ProjetEOF), OSMBénin (@OSMBénin) and
>>> other Western African OSM collectives.
>>>
>>> Nicolas on the behalf of the Association OSM Bénin and the collective
>>> Projet EOF.
>>>
>>> [1] : http://fr.ulule.com/imagerie-cotonou/
>>> [2] :
>>> https://projeteof.org/blog/crowdfunding-openstreetmap-au-benin-275km%C2%B2-dimagerie-satellite-haute-resolution-pour-cotonou-ce-1er-mai-2016/
>>> [3] : http://openstreetmap.bj/
>>> [4] : https://projeteof.org/blog/projet-eof/
>>> [5] : https://twitter.com/absaliou/status/566060712049770496
>>> [6] : https://twitter.com/agbadonou/status/719455286285570048
>>> [7] : https://twitter.com/agbadonou/status/677513770214801410
>>> [8] :
>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:SOTMTG-COM-OSMBJ-contenu.pdf
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Nicolas Chavent
>>> Projet OpenStreetMap (OSM)
>>> Projet Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
>>> Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
>>> Mobile (FRA): +33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
>>> Mobile (CIV): +225 78 12 76 99
>>> Email: [hidden email]
>>> Skype: c_nicolas
>>> Twitter: nicolas_chavent
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> talk mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>>
>>
>>
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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

Christoph Hormann
In reply to this post by nicolas chavent
On Monday 25 April 2016, nicolas chavent wrote:
> This is an easy mean to make a big difference and have a huge
> OpenStreetMap and opendata impact in Cotonou and Benin [...]

You are not seriously suggesting that paying a proprietary data vendor
for a likely restrictive license to use some imagery for mapping in OSM
is in support of the idea of open data?

If there is acute need for better imagery in a certain area and classic
mapping on the ground is not a reasonable alternative (why is that?) i
would suggest to approach satellite image providers if they can offer
help - you can see there have already been reactions in that direction.

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

Frederik Ramm
Christoph,

On 04/25/2016 06:46 PM, Christoph Hormann wrote:
> You are not seriously suggesting that paying a proprietary data vendor
> for a likely restrictive license to use some imagery for mapping in OSM
> is in support of the idea of open data?

I, too, am wary of this initiative because of the underlying idea that
working without aerial imagery is a waste of time. IMHO the
non-availability of aerial imagery primarily means that there will be
less armchair mapping which I consider a good thing (but I know that my
position on that is a minority position among humanitarian mappers).

Having said that, paying for propietary imagery isn't without precedent
in OSM, see for example http://wiki.openstreetmap.org and
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/WissensWert/40_-_Luftbilder_f%C3%BCr_OpenStreetMap

Bye
Frederik

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

Frederik Ramm
Hi,

On 04/25/2016 07:02 PM, Frederik Ramm wrote:
> see for example http://wiki.openstreetmap.org and

Gah, broke the link -

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Gaza#Commercial_aerial_photography

Bye
Frederik

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

SimonPoole
I'm slightly taken back by the number of people wanting to jump in and
make decisions for a local community on a topic that has little bearing
outside of their region. Surely is must be their prerogative to decide
how best to get imagery for their area, if at all (I do suspect that
they will welcome alternative offers, but that is obviously up to them).

Further I don't quite follow Christoph's argument. There is very very
little imagery used in OSM that is available on open (data) terms. As
long as the results of tracing etc  are essentially unencumbered nobody
seems to have had  issues with using non-free sources starting off with
yahoo in 2007 and yes we've paid with money and in other ways for
imagery in many places.

Simon



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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

Christoph Hormann
In reply to this post by Frederik Ramm
On Monday 25 April 2016, Frederik Ramm wrote:

> > You are not seriously suggesting that paying a proprietary data
> > vendor for a likely restrictive license to use some imagery for
> > mapping in OSM is in support of the idea of open data?
>
> I, too, am wary of this initiative because of the underlying idea
> that working without aerial imagery is a waste of time. IMHO the
> non-availability of aerial imagery primarily means that there will be
> less armchair mapping which I consider a good thing (but I know that
> my position on that is a minority position among humanitarian
> mappers).
>
> Having said that, paying for propietary imagery isn't without
> precedent in OSM, see for example http://wiki.openstreetmap.org and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/WissensWert/40_-_Luftbilder_f%C3%BCr_
>OpenStreetMap

Yes, given the inherent ambiguities in the matter my statement was
probably a bit too undifferentiated.

Paying for licensing commercial imagery and then making them available
for OSM can be good for OSM and therefore open data of course - this is
what Bing and Mapbox are doing on a significant scale for example but
generally the application for mapping in OSM is only a secondary use
here.  On the other hand if the community tries to acquire funds for
image licenses themselves for the sole purpose of mapping this is
highly questionable and i am not sure if i can imagine a situation
where i would consider the gain by this justifies both the expense (the
money could be used otherwise) and channeling money into non-open data
production.

Another perspective i consider important here: the open data movement
and in particular OSM have been very successful in breaking the
dominance of proprietary data and achieving a significant stand in the
overall market of map data, in particular human infrastructure mapping
(roads, buildings, POIs, addresses etc.).  In the field of imagery OTOH
open data has - although clearly on the rise these days - still a much
weaker standing.  This has reasons of course, like the significant
upfront investments necessary to produce this kind of data, but solid
support from the already much more successful OSM world by emphasizing
the need and desire for truly open image data would certainly help this
sector a lot.

--
Christoph Hormann
http://www.imagico.de/

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

Christoph Hormann
In reply to this post by SimonPoole
On Monday 25 April 2016, Simon Poole wrote:
>
> Further I don't quite follow Christoph's argument. There is very very
> little imagery used in OSM that is available on open (data) terms. As
> long as the results of tracing etc  are essentially unencumbered
> nobody seems to have had  issues with using non-free sources starting
> off with yahoo in 2007 and yes we've paid with money and in other
> ways for imagery in many places.

I tried to clarify my standpoint in my reply to Frederik.

In addition i also think open imagery is currently severely underused in
OSM mapping due to convenient availability of not really open but free
to use in OSM imagery in Bing and Mapbox.  This applies both to high
resolution aerial images available from local providers under open data
terms - you know the frequent complaints by locals that armchair
mappers try to 'correct' local mapping based on outdated Bing imagery -
and lower resolution open satellite images which are rarely used at all
except for the 15 year old base data in Bing despite offering a lot of
information useful for mapping.  I find this regrettable in some way -
mappers should be aware of and have access to open imagery sources that
are available as much as possible - but also understandable, people use
what is most readily available and most convenient for them and there
is little incentive in providing alternatives just because they are
open if they don't provide significant advantages for practical use.

And you are right - we should not be so arrogant to think we know things
better than the local community in Benin.

--
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http://www.imagico.de/

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

SimonPoole


Am 25.04.2016 um 20:41 schrieb Christoph Hormann:

> I tried to clarify my standpoint in my reply to Frederik.
>
> In addition i also think open imagery is currently severely underused in
> OSM mapping due to convenient availability of not really open but free
> to use in OSM imagery in Bing and Mapbox.  This applies both to high
> resolution aerial images available from local providers under open data
> terms - you know the frequent complaints by locals that armchair
> mappers try to 'correct' local mapping based on outdated Bing imagery -
> and lower resolution open satellite images which are rarely used at all
> except for the 15 year old base data in Bing despite offering a lot of
> information useful for mapping.  I find this regrettable in some way -
> mappers should be aware of and have access to open imagery sources that
> are available as much as possible - but also understandable, people use
> what is most readily available and most convenient for them and there
> is little incentive in providing alternatives just because they are
> open if they don't provide significant advantages for practical use.
Actually this has, at least on the browser embedded editor sid,e
improved quite a bit. For example the Canton of Zürich released 10cm
nominal resolution imagery early this year and at least in iD you will
get this imagery as default now if you edit there, just as you will get
the imagery from the Canton Aargau here (which while essentially just a
service fee, we did pay CHF 200 for). While I'm not particularly happy
with just a flag to indicate the preferable imagery for a region, it
does work most of the time.

Simon


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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

dieterdreist
In reply to this post by Christoph Hormann


sent from a phone

> Il giorno 25 apr 2016, alle ore 20:41, Christoph Hormann <[hidden email]> ha scritto:
>
> what is most readily available and most convenient for them and there
> is little incentive in providing alternatives just because they are
> open if they don't provide significant advantages for practical use.


regarding Bing aerial imagery, other imagery will likely be better referenced, at least this is my experience around here, even if the resolution of Bing might be higher.

cheers,
Martin
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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

nicolas chavent
Hi there,

Wow! None of the folks from the Association OSM Bénin nor those from the collective ProjetEOF who worked with the Benin mappers on this crowdfunding for imagery on 275km2 of Cotonou would have expected that email traffic.

Great to see this talk on the talk list!
Great also to read that this talk may develop into future new creative ways for Digital Globe and Map Box Satellite to assist OSM in Benin (many places outside of Cotonou which is likely to be handled through this crowdfunding) and in Western Africa (many places also) not to mention other places of this earth. I am not sure Christoph, if Kevin and Mikel will meet your criteria of 100% opendata imagery, surely this would be creative and awesome.

A couple of points from my side, prior the mappers from Benin will talk and share their perspectives on this topic and the reasons that lead them to crowdfund for Cotonou and to bring this project to its end. 

At reading this thread in my late evening, comes first the surprise, that Simon puts up nicely, I am re-using his very words:

I'm slightly taken back by the number of people wanting to jump in and
make decisions for a local community on a topic that has little bearing
outside of their region. Surely is must be their prerogative to decide
how best to get imagery for their area, if at all (I do suspect that
they will welcome alternative offers, but that is obviously up to them).

Further I don't quite follow Christoph's argument. There is very very
little imagery used in OSM that is available on open (data) terms. As
long as the results of tracing etc  are essentially unencumbered nobody
seems to have had  issues with using non-free sources starting off with
yahoo in 2007 and yes we've paid with money and in other ways for
imagery in many places.


Frederik, field work is highly valued and practised in Benin and Western Africa as reflected in mappers stats, lists, wiki, social media (Twitter and Facebook) of mappers and local groups. The Benin guys as emailed have been actively mapping via field survey and remote mapping in Benin and Western Africa over the past 3 years. They have been active also in Cotonou through this time, with their own means, voluntarily in a poor country. They figured out that this situation had to change in Cotonou and got organized. One thing, you can be positive about, is that access to high res imagery over Cotonou will not kill their appetite for field work.
 
Christoph you are right. Yes, it would have been better to acquire an imagery that could be fully distributed in opendata and not for tracing in OSM only the way this work for Bing, MapBox, specific humanitarian contexts (some Charter activations, the Imagery To The Crowd/ Map Give program of the US State Department) but this was out of reach. Shall the Benin folks have to keep surveying voluntarily the economic capital of their country instead of making the current compromise which has many precedents in OSM? Although the imagery is not fully served and distributed in opendata, through the generating of OSM data over Cotonou, it will mark a breakthrough for the local opendata movement by making the OSM base map of the city available to all. Like in many other places, this eventually will foster over time via a critical mass approach, the opening of geographical information. This is in that sense that opendata is meant in the email, blog post and project description in Ulule. Last, I agree with your idea (seeking full opendata imagery) but think that in making it happening one shall differentiate territories and contexts and that Cotonou, Benin is not ideal.

John, Ulule does not charge 40%, the fees reasonably amount to 7 or 8%, that's a notable difference.

John, Kevin and Mikel. Without commenting any further Simon first paragraph. Technically, what you are proposing (using the crowdfunding money for other purposes) may not even be possible or at least is not a good practise (not to say more). This may result into back clashes and distrust with the over 56 people who funded this project (the purchase of high resolution imagery over Cotonou for OSM Benin) or a bad record with Ulule. This can be negative for OSM Benin folks in the future shall they decide to crowdfund again for a similar or a different need.

Kevin and Mikel, the @OSMBenin twitter account indicates that
- your offers to assist OSM Bénin on Cotonou with imagery on the behalf of Digital Globe and Mapbox have been well heard.
- the imagery need over that part of Cotonou will be addressed via this crowdfunding. 
- OSM Benin is keen on submitting other Areas Of Interest (AOIs) in Benin and in Western African in coordination with other Western African local OSM groups, they indicate that they are working on a uMap with priority AOIs.
This could be a creative and positive development of this crowdfunding.

Last, John which charities have you in minds to come to Benin and do the field work Kevin alluded to for the amount OSM Benin proposed to raise E 2,2k and how do you see this relating to the work of those mappers from Benin ?  

Best,
Nicolas
 

On Mon, Apr 25, 2016 at 10:47 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer <[hidden email]> wrote:


sent from a phone

> Il giorno 25 apr 2016, alle ore 20:41, Christoph Hormann <[hidden email]> ha scritto:
>
> what is most readily available and most convenient for them and there
> is little incentive in providing alternatives just because they are
> open if they don't provide significant advantages for practical use.


regarding Bing aerial imagery, other imagery will likely be better referenced, at least this is my experience around here, even if the resolution of Bing might be higher.

cheers,
Martin
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Projet Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
Mobile (FRA): +33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
Mobile (CIV): +225 78 12 76 99
Email: [hidden email]
Skype: c_nicolas
Twitter: nicolas_chavent

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

john whelan-2
>John, Ulule does not charge 40%, the fees reasonably amount to 7 or 8%, that's a notable difference. 

If I donate $100 to a charity the net cost to me is $60 and $100 is more or less available at the end.  If I donate $60 to the crowdsourcing then $55 arrives at the end.  So if we can get creative with a charity the money goes further.  Different western countries have different rules but basically if it can be channeled through a charity more cash ends up on the ground.

West Africa, WHO are vacinating against polio is either there or not far away, they need maps where do people live.  MSF have HOT projects around that area.  Have a dig in HOT and you'll see sponsored projects around.  All the HOT projects suffer from having not that many people on the ground for street names etc.  The charities have purchased image data before but also DG and Mapbox have been very helpful to them.  If you're serious about wanting to improve the state of the map in Bénin then working with a charity might help both sides.

I note there is HOT mapping in Togo which is close by at the moment "Bâtiments, routes, chemins, zones résidentielles" which I assume is the sort of thing you're after.  Have a chat to the organizers of that project and see which charities are involved if any.  There are four projects in Bénin at the moment.

Currently for Cotonou there is some Mapbox imagery not the greatest but I think you could squeeze a few more highways etc out of it.

The HOT mailing list is probably the place to start and to be honest I thunk that is where the discussion should be taking place, but currently they're distracted by a couple of earthquakes.  I think the most effective mapping comes out of a mixture of local knowledge and armchair mapping where the map is blank.  Some of the charities are very well organised MSF for example have developed expertise in the optimum size of HOT project and complexity.  They also have tame validators and that seems to be key to getting a HOT project completed in a reasonable time frame.  http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_Tasking_Manager/Validating_data is worth reading through. 

The Treasury Board Canada might seem an unlikely source of assistance but they have been instrumental in creating a open data license that is acceptable to OSM and are working with at least one African country to use the same license.  I think Jo has been importing a large number of schools complete with names in one African country, it took a considerable amount of time to get the license sorted out.  I understand if you have enough mappers on the ground everything can get mapped but for quickness sometimes a few high quality imports that are carefully imported can have benefits.

So if you can raise the cash fine but if you can get the imagery in other ways perhaps a few GPS units or a few smart phones for collecting POI data might be an acceptable way of spending the cash raised.  If your crowd funding doesn't quite raise enough cash then sometimes there are other ways to get the imagery.

Cheerio John



On 25 April 2016 at 18:26, nicolas chavent <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi there,

Wow! None of the folks from the Association OSM Bénin nor those from the collective ProjetEOF who worked with the Benin mappers on this crowdfunding for imagery on 275km2 of Cotonou would have expected that email traffic.

Great to see this talk on the talk list!
Great also to read that this talk may develop into future new creative ways for Digital Globe and Map Box Satellite to assist OSM in Benin (many places outside of Cotonou which is likely to be handled through this crowdfunding) and in Western Africa (many places also) not to mention other places of this earth. I am not sure Christoph, if Kevin and Mikel will meet your criteria of 100% opendata imagery, surely this would be creative and awesome.

A couple of points from my side, prior the mappers from Benin will talk and share their perspectives on this topic and the reasons that lead them to crowdfund for Cotonou and to bring this project to its end. 

At reading this thread in my late evening, comes first the surprise, that Simon puts up nicely, I am re-using his very words:

I'm slightly taken back by the number of people wanting to jump in and
make decisions for a local community on a topic that has little bearing
outside of their region. Surely is must be their prerogative to decide
how best to get imagery for their area, if at all (I do suspect that
they will welcome alternative offers, but that is obviously up to them).

Further I don't quite follow Christoph's argument. There is very very
little imagery used in OSM that is available on open (data) terms. As
long as the results of tracing etc  are essentially unencumbered nobody
seems to have had  issues with using non-free sources starting off with
yahoo in 2007 and yes we've paid with money and in other ways for
imagery in many places.


Frederik, field work is highly valued and practised in Benin and Western Africa as reflected in mappers stats, lists, wiki, social media (Twitter and Facebook) of mappers and local groups. The Benin guys as emailed have been actively mapping via field survey and remote mapping in Benin and Western Africa over the past 3 years. They have been active also in Cotonou through this time, with their own means, voluntarily in a poor country. They figured out that this situation had to change in Cotonou and got organized. One thing, you can be positive about, is that access to high res imagery over Cotonou will not kill their appetite for field work.
 
Christoph you are right. Yes, it would have been better to acquire an imagery that could be fully distributed in opendata and not for tracing in OSM only the way this work for Bing, MapBox, specific humanitarian contexts (some Charter activations, the Imagery To The Crowd/ Map Give program of the US State Department) but this was out of reach. Shall the Benin folks have to keep surveying voluntarily the economic capital of their country instead of making the current compromise which has many precedents in OSM? Although the imagery is not fully served and distributed in opendata, through the generating of OSM data over Cotonou, it will mark a breakthrough for the local opendata movement by making the OSM base map of the city available to all. Like in many other places, this eventually will foster over time via a critical mass approach, the opening of geographical information. This is in that sense that opendata is meant in the email, blog post and project description in Ulule. Last, I agree with your idea (seeking full opendata imagery) but think that in making it happening one shall differentiate territories and contexts and that Cotonou, Benin is not ideal.

John, Ulule does not charge 40%, the fees reasonably amount to 7 or 8%, that's a notable difference.

John, Kevin and Mikel. Without commenting any further Simon first paragraph. Technically, what you are proposing (using the crowdfunding money for other purposes) may not even be possible or at least is not a good practise (not to say more). This may result into back clashes and distrust with the over 56 people who funded this project (the purchase of high resolution imagery over Cotonou for OSM Benin) or a bad record with Ulule. This can be negative for OSM Benin folks in the future shall they decide to crowdfund again for a similar or a different need.

Kevin and Mikel, the @OSMBenin twitter account indicates that
- your offers to assist OSM Bénin on Cotonou with imagery on the behalf of Digital Globe and Mapbox have been well heard.
- the imagery need over that part of Cotonou will be addressed via this crowdfunding. 
- OSM Benin is keen on submitting other Areas Of Interest (AOIs) in Benin and in Western African in coordination with other Western African local OSM groups, they indicate that they are working on a uMap with priority AOIs.
This could be a creative and positive development of this crowdfunding.

Last, John which charities have you in minds to come to Benin and do the field work Kevin alluded to for the amount OSM Benin proposed to raise E 2,2k and how do you see this relating to the work of those mappers from Benin ?  

Best,
Nicolas
 

On Mon, Apr 25, 2016 at 10:47 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer <[hidden email]> wrote:


sent from a phone

> Il giorno 25 apr 2016, alle ore 20:41, Christoph Hormann <[hidden email]> ha scritto:
>
> what is most readily available and most convenient for them and there
> is little incentive in providing alternatives just because they are
> open if they don't provide significant advantages for practical use.


regarding Bing aerial imagery, other imagery will likely be better referenced, at least this is my experience around here, even if the resolution of Bing might be higher.

cheers,
Martin
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Projet Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
Mobile (FRA): <a href="tel:%2B33%20%280%296%2052%2040%2078%2020" value="+33652407820" target="_blank">+33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
Mobile (CIV): <a href="tel:%2B225%2078%2012%2076%2099" value="+22578127699" target="_blank">+225 78 12 76 99
Email: [hidden email]
Skype: c_nicolas
Twitter: nicolas_chavent

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

nicolas chavent
In reply to this post by nicolas chavent
Hi John,

There is a local OSM group active in Benin since mid 2013,
This group is skilled they got trained via (capacity building missions run by the collective Projet EOF) and had been always self training and growing their skills, growing their community and training Academic, Benin Red Cross Volunteers, Civil workers from local government, folks from the local tech scene etc...
This group has a few equipments at hand,
They share a co-working space (Blolab) in Cotonou with other tech actors,
They have been active in their country (several places and various mapping project) and in Western Africa through regional 3 to 4 weeks long capacity building missions involving a lot of field and remote mapping work
They operate mostly on a voluntary basis with low means and they grow their map and their community.
They decided to crowdfund for these 275km2 high res imagery in Cotonou because this has been blocking them and that a few additional GPS Units will not make the difference, but this imagery will do!

Since the Haiti quake, community empowerment is at the center of the agenda of humanitarian and development actors as shown by the Katmandu Living Lab experience in the Nepal Earthquake (praised in mainstream and professionals see The Guardian (1)) or a glance at the agenda of the World Humanitarian Summit will gather this coming May in Istambul. Benin (but also Sénégal, Mali, Togo, Burkina, Niger, Ivory Coast) show the example of organized OpenStreetMap collectives and communities. They are building their map and their community without the support of charities, or supporting charities, local / central government, academic, development/ humanitarian actors.

All this is happening in Western Africa as the result of capacity building programs that I started for HOT US Inc in July 2013 with the support of the Organisation Internationale de la Francophonie (OIF) and then since Fall 2013 outside of HOT US Inc within the collective Projet EOF (mixing folks from French speaking countries from the "north" & "south"). All those actions have been conceived and carried out with very low cost budget schemes (under which HOT US Inc decided not to operate) to support the emerging of local OSM communities and this has been working thanks to experienced persons (there are many of those in the ProjetEOF who by the way build the HOT Project and HOT US Inc in the early days) and enthusisasm. 

Now that a local OSM community like Benin is organized, why can't this community act autonomously, why should it resort to a charity to map their town? Why should it inform and discuss only in the hot mailing list and not on the talk list where the community life of OSM is happening? Your email cast doubts or rise questions about how a charity work with local communities, about partnerships and partners roles. 

With a true respect for local OSM communities groups, no doubt that there is some potential to fulfill from the projects you mentioned (and that are not new to OSM Bénin as well as Projet EOF folks), let's see realize that potential but not by speaking on top of those communities and by not recognizing their strengths.

Distributing additional Digital Globe or Mapbox high resolution satellite imagery in other Areas Of Interest (AOIs) of Benin and Weestern Africa outside of those 275 km2 of Cotonou almost secured can be a first step. 

Thanks
Nicolas

 

 

On Tue, Apr 26, 2016 at 1:52 AM, john whelan <[hidden email]> wrote:
>John, Ulule does not charge 40%, the fees reasonably amount to 7 or 8%, that's a notable difference. 

If I donate $100 to a charity the net cost to me is $60 and $100 is more or less available at the end.  If I donate $60 to the crowdsourcing then $55 arrives at the end.  So if we can get creative with a charity the money goes further.  Different western countries have different rules but basically if it can be channeled through a charity more cash ends up on the ground.

West Africa, WHO are vacinating against polio is either there or not far away, they need maps where do people live.  MSF have HOT projects around that area.  Have a dig in HOT and you'll see sponsored projects around.  All the HOT projects suffer from having not that many people on the ground for street names etc.  The charities have purchased image data before but also DG and Mapbox have been very helpful to them.  If you're serious about wanting to improve the state of the map in Bénin then working with a charity might help both sides.

I note there is HOT mapping in Togo which is close by at the moment "Bâtiments, routes, chemins, zones résidentielles" which I assume is the sort of thing you're after.  Have a chat to the organizers of that project and see which charities are involved if any.  There are four projects in Bénin at the moment.

Currently for Cotonou there is some Mapbox imagery not the greatest but I think you could squeeze a few more highways etc out of it.

The HOT mailing list is probably the place to start and to be honest I thunk that is where the discussion should be taking place, but currently they're distracted by a couple of earthquakes.  I think the most effective mapping comes out of a mixture of local knowledge and armchair mapping where the map is blank.  Some of the charities are very well organised MSF for example have developed expertise in the optimum size of HOT project and complexity.  They also have tame validators and that seems to be key to getting a HOT project completed in a reasonable time frame.  http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_Tasking_Manager/Validating_data is worth reading through. 

The Treasury Board Canada might seem an unlikely source of assistance but they have been instrumental in creating a open data license that is acceptable to OSM and are working with at least one African country to use the same license.  I think Jo has been importing a large number of schools complete with names in one African country, it took a considerable amount of time to get the license sorted out.  I understand if you have enough mappers on the ground everything can get mapped but for quickness sometimes a few high quality imports that are carefully imported can have benefits.

So if you can raise the cash fine but if you can get the imagery in other ways perhaps a few GPS units or a few smart phones for collecting POI data might be an acceptable way of spending the cash raised.  If your crowd funding doesn't quite raise enough cash then sometimes there are other ways to get the imagery.

Cheerio John



On 25 April 2016 at 18:26, nicolas chavent <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi there,

Wow! None of the folks from the Association OSM Bénin nor those from the collective ProjetEOF who worked with the Benin mappers on this crowdfunding for imagery on 275km2 of Cotonou would have expected that email traffic.

Great to see this talk on the talk list!
Great also to read that this talk may develop into future new creative ways for Digital Globe and Map Box Satellite to assist OSM in Benin (many places outside of Cotonou which is likely to be handled through this crowdfunding) and in Western Africa (many places also) not to mention other places of this earth. I am not sure Christoph, if Kevin and Mikel will meet your criteria of 100% opendata imagery, surely this would be creative and awesome.

A couple of points from my side, prior the mappers from Benin will talk and share their perspectives on this topic and the reasons that lead them to crowdfund for Cotonou and to bring this project to its end. 

At reading this thread in my late evening, comes first the surprise, that Simon puts up nicely, I am re-using his very words:

I'm slightly taken back by the number of people wanting to jump in and
make decisions for a local community on a topic that has little bearing
outside of their region. Surely is must be their prerogative to decide
how best to get imagery for their area, if at all (I do suspect that
they will welcome alternative offers, but that is obviously up to them).

Further I don't quite follow Christoph's argument. There is very very
little imagery used in OSM that is available on open (data) terms. As
long as the results of tracing etc  are essentially unencumbered nobody
seems to have had  issues with using non-free sources starting off with
yahoo in 2007 and yes we've paid with money and in other ways for
imagery in many places.


Frederik, field work is highly valued and practised in Benin and Western Africa as reflected in mappers stats, lists, wiki, social media (Twitter and Facebook) of mappers and local groups. The Benin guys as emailed have been actively mapping via field survey and remote mapping in Benin and Western Africa over the past 3 years. They have been active also in Cotonou through this time, with their own means, voluntarily in a poor country. They figured out that this situation had to change in Cotonou and got organized. One thing, you can be positive about, is that access to high res imagery over Cotonou will not kill their appetite for field work.
 
Christoph you are right. Yes, it would have been better to acquire an imagery that could be fully distributed in opendata and not for tracing in OSM only the way this work for Bing, MapBox, specific humanitarian contexts (some Charter activations, the Imagery To The Crowd/ Map Give program of the US State Department) but this was out of reach. Shall the Benin folks have to keep surveying voluntarily the economic capital of their country instead of making the current compromise which has many precedents in OSM? Although the imagery is not fully served and distributed in opendata, through the generating of OSM data over Cotonou, it will mark a breakthrough for the local opendata movement by making the OSM base map of the city available to all. Like in many other places, this eventually will foster over time via a critical mass approach, the opening of geographical information. This is in that sense that opendata is meant in the email, blog post and project description in Ulule. Last, I agree with your idea (seeking full opendata imagery) but think that in making it happening one shall differentiate territories and contexts and that Cotonou, Benin is not ideal.

John, Ulule does not charge 40%, the fees reasonably amount to 7 or 8%, that's a notable difference.

John, Kevin and Mikel. Without commenting any further Simon first paragraph. Technically, what you are proposing (using the crowdfunding money for other purposes) may not even be possible or at least is not a good practise (not to say more). This may result into back clashes and distrust with the over 56 people who funded this project (the purchase of high resolution imagery over Cotonou for OSM Benin) or a bad record with Ulule. This can be negative for OSM Benin folks in the future shall they decide to crowdfund again for a similar or a different need.

Kevin and Mikel, the @OSMBenin twitter account indicates that
- your offers to assist OSM Bénin on Cotonou with imagery on the behalf of Digital Globe and Mapbox have been well heard.
- the imagery need over that part of Cotonou will be addressed via this crowdfunding. 
- OSM Benin is keen on submitting other Areas Of Interest (AOIs) in Benin and in Western African in coordination with other Western African local OSM groups, they indicate that they are working on a uMap with priority AOIs.
This could be a creative and positive development of this crowdfunding.

Last, John which charities have you in minds to come to Benin and do the field work Kevin alluded to for the amount OSM Benin proposed to raise E 2,2k and how do you see this relating to the work of those mappers from Benin ?  

Best,
Nicolas
 

On Mon, Apr 25, 2016 at 10:47 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer <[hidden email]> wrote:


sent from a phone

> Il giorno 25 apr 2016, alle ore 20:41, Christoph Hormann <[hidden email]> ha scritto:
>
> what is most readily available and most convenient for them and there
> is little incentive in providing alternatives just because they are
> open if they don't provide significant advantages for practical use.


regarding Bing aerial imagery, other imagery will likely be better referenced, at least this is my experience around here, even if the resolution of Bing might be higher.

cheers,
Martin
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Mobile (CIV): <a href="tel:%2B225%2078%2012%2076%2099" value="+22578127699" target="_blank">+225 78 12 76 99
Email: [hidden email]
Skype: c_nicolas
Twitter: nicolas_chavent

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--
Nicolas Chavent
Projet OpenStreetMap (OSM)
Projet Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
Mobile (FRA): +33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
Mobile (CIV): +225 78 12 76 99
Email: [hidden email]
Skype: c_nicolas
Twitter: nicolas_chavent

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou by 1-May 2016!

Enock Seth Nyamador
Greetings,

Glad to see many views and comments coming up on this topic. 

Best,

- Enock
OSMGhana
​ | ​
UMaT, Tarkwa

On Tue, Apr 26, 2016 at 11:50 AM, nicolas chavent <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi John,

There is a local OSM group active in Benin since mid 2013,
This group is skilled they got trained via (capacity building missions run by the collective Projet EOF) and had been always self training and growing their skills, growing their community and training Academic, Benin Red Cross Volunteers, Civil workers from local government, folks from the local tech scene etc...
This group has a few equipments at hand,
They share a co-working space (Blolab) in Cotonou with other tech actors,
They have been active in their country (several places and various mapping project) and in Western Africa through regional 3 to 4 weeks long capacity building missions involving a lot of field and remote mapping work
They operate mostly on a voluntary basis with low means and they grow their map and their community.
They decided to crowdfund for these 275km2 high res imagery in Cotonou because this has been blocking them and that a few additional GPS Units will not make the difference, but this imagery will do!

Since the Haiti quake, community empowerment is at the center of the agenda of humanitarian and development actors as shown by the Katmandu Living Lab experience in the Nepal Earthquake (praised in mainstream and professionals see The Guardian (1)) or a glance at the agenda of the World Humanitarian Summit will gather this coming May in Istambul. Benin (but also Sénégal, Mali, Togo, Burkina, Niger, Ivory Coast) show the example of organized OpenStreetMap collectives and communities. They are building their map and their community without the support of charities, or supporting charities, local / central government, academic, development/ humanitarian actors.

All this is happening in Western Africa as the result of capacity building programs that I started for HOT US Inc in July 2013 with the support of the Organisation Internationale de la Francophonie (OIF) and then since Fall 2013 outside of HOT US Inc within the collective Projet EOF (mixing folks from French speaking countries from the "north" & "south"). All those actions have been conceived and carried out with very low cost budget schemes (under which HOT US Inc decided not to operate) to support the emerging of local OSM communities and this has been working thanks to experienced persons (there are many of those in the ProjetEOF who by the way build the HOT Project and HOT US Inc in the early days) and enthusisasm. 

Now that a local OSM community like Benin is organized, why can't this community act autonomously, why should it resort to a charity to map their town? Why should it inform and discuss only in the hot mailing list and not on the talk list where the community life of OSM is happening? Your email cast doubts or rise questions about how a charity work with local communities, about partnerships and partners roles. 

With a true respect for local OSM communities groups, no doubt that there is some potential to fulfill from the projects you mentioned (and that are not new to OSM Bénin as well as Projet EOF folks), let's see realize that potential but not by speaking on top of those communities and by not recognizing their strengths.

Distributing additional Digital Globe or Mapbox high resolution satellite imagery in other Areas Of Interest (AOIs) of Benin and Weestern Africa outside of those 275 km2 of Cotonou almost secured can be a first step. 

Thanks
Nicolas

 

 

On Tue, Apr 26, 2016 at 1:52 AM, john whelan <[hidden email]> wrote:
>John, Ulule does not charge 40%, the fees reasonably amount to 7 or 8%, that's a notable difference. 

If I donate $100 to a charity the net cost to me is $60 and $100 is more or less available at the end.  If I donate $60 to the crowdsourcing then $55 arrives at the end.  So if we can get creative with a charity the money goes further.  Different western countries have different rules but basically if it can be channeled through a charity more cash ends up on the ground.

West Africa, WHO are vacinating against polio is either there or not far away, they need maps where do people live.  MSF have HOT projects around that area.  Have a dig in HOT and you'll see sponsored projects around.  All the HOT projects suffer from having not that many people on the ground for street names etc.  The charities have purchased image data before but also DG and Mapbox have been very helpful to them.  If you're serious about wanting to improve the state of the map in Bénin then working with a charity might help both sides.

I note there is HOT mapping in Togo which is close by at the moment "Bâtiments, routes, chemins, zones résidentielles" which I assume is the sort of thing you're after.  Have a chat to the organizers of that project and see which charities are involved if any.  There are four projects in Bénin at the moment.

Currently for Cotonou there is some Mapbox imagery not the greatest but I think you could squeeze a few more highways etc out of it.

The HOT mailing list is probably the place to start and to be honest I thunk that is where the discussion should be taking place, but currently they're distracted by a couple of earthquakes.  I think the most effective mapping comes out of a mixture of local knowledge and armchair mapping where the map is blank.  Some of the charities are very well organised MSF for example have developed expertise in the optimum size of HOT project and complexity.  They also have tame validators and that seems to be key to getting a HOT project completed in a reasonable time frame.  http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_Tasking_Manager/Validating_data is worth reading through. 

The Treasury Board Canada might seem an unlikely source of assistance but they have been instrumental in creating a open data license that is acceptable to OSM and are working with at least one African country to use the same license.  I think Jo has been importing a large number of schools complete with names in one African country, it took a considerable amount of time to get the license sorted out.  I understand if you have enough mappers on the ground everything can get mapped but for quickness sometimes a few high quality imports that are carefully imported can have benefits.

So if you can raise the cash fine but if you can get the imagery in other ways perhaps a few GPS units or a few smart phones for collecting POI data might be an acceptable way of spending the cash raised.  If your crowd funding doesn't quite raise enough cash then sometimes there are other ways to get the imagery.

Cheerio John



On 25 April 2016 at 18:26, nicolas chavent <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi there,

Wow! None of the folks from the Association OSM Bénin nor those from the collective ProjetEOF who worked with the Benin mappers on this crowdfunding for imagery on 275km2 of Cotonou would have expected that email traffic.

Great to see this talk on the talk list!
Great also to read that this talk may develop into future new creative ways for Digital Globe and Map Box Satellite to assist OSM in Benin (many places outside of Cotonou which is likely to be handled through this crowdfunding) and in Western Africa (many places also) not to mention other places of this earth. I am not sure Christoph, if Kevin and Mikel will meet your criteria of 100% opendata imagery, surely this would be creative and awesome.

A couple of points from my side, prior the mappers from Benin will talk and share their perspectives on this topic and the reasons that lead them to crowdfund for Cotonou and to bring this project to its end. 

At reading this thread in my late evening, comes first the surprise, that Simon puts up nicely, I am re-using his very words:

I'm slightly taken back by the number of people wanting to jump in and
make decisions for a local community on a topic that has little bearing
outside of their region. Surely is must be their prerogative to decide
how best to get imagery for their area, if at all (I do suspect that
they will welcome alternative offers, but that is obviously up to them).

Further I don't quite follow Christoph's argument. There is very very
little imagery used in OSM that is available on open (data) terms. As
long as the results of tracing etc  are essentially unencumbered nobody
seems to have had  issues with using non-free sources starting off with
yahoo in 2007 and yes we've paid with money and in other ways for
imagery in many places.


Frederik, field work is highly valued and practised in Benin and Western Africa as reflected in mappers stats, lists, wiki, social media (Twitter and Facebook) of mappers and local groups. The Benin guys as emailed have been actively mapping via field survey and remote mapping in Benin and Western Africa over the past 3 years. They have been active also in Cotonou through this time, with their own means, voluntarily in a poor country. They figured out that this situation had to change in Cotonou and got organized. One thing, you can be positive about, is that access to high res imagery over Cotonou will not kill their appetite for field work.
 
Christoph you are right. Yes, it would have been better to acquire an imagery that could be fully distributed in opendata and not for tracing in OSM only the way this work for Bing, MapBox, specific humanitarian contexts (some Charter activations, the Imagery To The Crowd/ Map Give program of the US State Department) but this was out of reach. Shall the Benin folks have to keep surveying voluntarily the economic capital of their country instead of making the current compromise which has many precedents in OSM? Although the imagery is not fully served and distributed in opendata, through the generating of OSM data over Cotonou, it will mark a breakthrough for the local opendata movement by making the OSM base map of the city available to all. Like in many other places, this eventually will foster over time via a critical mass approach, the opening of geographical information. This is in that sense that opendata is meant in the email, blog post and project description in Ulule. Last, I agree with your idea (seeking full opendata imagery) but think that in making it happening one shall differentiate territories and contexts and that Cotonou, Benin is not ideal.

John, Ulule does not charge 40%, the fees reasonably amount to 7 or 8%, that's a notable difference.

John, Kevin and Mikel. Without commenting any further Simon first paragraph. Technically, what you are proposing (using the crowdfunding money for other purposes) may not even be possible or at least is not a good practise (not to say more). This may result into back clashes and distrust with the over 56 people who funded this project (the purchase of high resolution imagery over Cotonou for OSM Benin) or a bad record with Ulule. This can be negative for OSM Benin folks in the future shall they decide to crowdfund again for a similar or a different need.

Kevin and Mikel, the @OSMBenin twitter account indicates that
- your offers to assist OSM Bénin on Cotonou with imagery on the behalf of Digital Globe and Mapbox have been well heard.
- the imagery need over that part of Cotonou will be addressed via this crowdfunding. 
- OSM Benin is keen on submitting other Areas Of Interest (AOIs) in Benin and in Western African in coordination with other Western African local OSM groups, they indicate that they are working on a uMap with priority AOIs.
This could be a creative and positive development of this crowdfunding.

Last, John which charities have you in minds to come to Benin and do the field work Kevin alluded to for the amount OSM Benin proposed to raise E 2,2k and how do you see this relating to the work of those mappers from Benin ?  

Best,
Nicolas
 

On Mon, Apr 25, 2016 at 10:47 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer <[hidden email]> wrote:


sent from a phone

> Il giorno 25 apr 2016, alle ore 20:41, Christoph Hormann <[hidden email]> ha scritto:
>
> what is most readily available and most convenient for them and there
> is little incentive in providing alternatives just because they are
> open if they don't provide significant advantages for practical use.


regarding Bing aerial imagery, other imagery will likely be better referenced, at least this is my experience around here, even if the resolution of Bing might be higher.

cheers,
Martin
_______________________________________________
talk mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk



--
Nicolas Chavent
Projet OpenStreetMap (OSM)
Projet Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
Mobile (FRA): <a href="tel:%2B33%20%280%296%2052%2040%2078%2020" value="+33652407820" target="_blank">+33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
Mobile (CIV): <a href="tel:%2B225%2078%2012%2076%2099" value="+22578127699" target="_blank">+225 78 12 76 99
Email: [hidden email]
Skype: c_nicolas
Twitter: nicolas_chavent

_______________________________________________
talk mailing list
[hidden email]
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--
Nicolas Chavent
Projet OpenStreetMap (OSM)
Projet Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
Mobile (FRA): <a href="tel:%2B33%20%280%296%2052%2040%2078%2020" value="+33652407820" target="_blank">+33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
Mobile (CIV): <a href="tel:%2B225%2078%2012%2076%2099" value="+22578127699" target="_blank">+225 78 12 76 99
Email: [hidden email]
Skype: c_nicolas
Twitter: nicolas_chavent

_______________________________________________
talk mailing list
[hidden email]
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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou

Mikel Maron-3
In reply to this post by Frederik Ramm
>http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Gaza#Commercial_aerial_photography

Yes, we raised money to buy imagery, in the first HOT activation. Yahoo imagery only covered the southeast part of Gaza. If we had a mechanism to request imagery from providers, we certainly would have. The situation is very different today for OSM. You only need to look at the Ecuador response to see the willingness of imagery providers to help when there is a need.

Mikel

On Monday, April 25, 2016, 1:32 PM, Frederik Ramm <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi,

On 04/25/2016 07:02 PM, Frederik Ramm wrote:
> see for example http://wiki.openstreetmap.org and

Gah, broke the link -

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Gaza#Commercial_aerial_photography


Bye
Frederik

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Re: Crowdfunding for OpenStreetMap in Bénin : 275km² high resolution satellite imagery for Cotonou

Rod Bera
Hi John,

You seem not to imagine for a second people in the South can take
initiatives and do things by themselves, without resorting to a charity
from the North.

We agree charities can be effective (e.g. when there is a quake or
typhoon) by making possible a quick release of imagery.
Then only the real mapping work begins, by a reliable task force of OSM
mappers, maybe with HOT to organise things a bit.
However, such dramatic events happen in and around Cotonou too (esp.
floods), but seemingly not with enough casualties to hit the headlines.
Or to get proper imagery.

Besides, people in Cotonou and other areas of Benin have been waiting
for a while for decent maps, and OSM Bénin has worked a lot in an
adverse context (power and network outages, sometimes GPS, often field
papers with no workable base map, etc.)

As long as they were mapping in dire conditions, they seemed to attract
no attention from those imagery providers.

Now their initiative is having some success, imagery providers pop in.
Fair enough, and welcome, there are many more areas with no decent
imagery. And OSM Benin are keen to issue a list of other
imagery-deprived areas in Benin... and elsewhere.

You seem to argue resorting to charities and well established imagery
providers is better than doing thing oneself.
With such views OSM would simply not exist, we would still be relying on
mapping agencies, and there would have been no worldwide open alternative.

This argumentation "why would you do things by yourselves? we can give
you better" is a bit patronising and at the opposite of the OSM spirit.
Again, with such an ethos there would be no OSM project (back in 2004
and for several years after "well, mapping agencies are doing tremendous
work, after all, why sould we work on an alternative?" was a common answer)

This argumentation reminds me of the recent "go and buy yourselves
petrol for your bikes instead, and leave us the imagery stuff" (Mikel, I
know it's not an exact quotation, and that by the way you didn't want to
be insulting, but try and imagine how the fellow mappers in Benin can
take this).

Of course we are happy to see people "do better", but we are proud to
have communities who can cope without having to flatter those dominant
organisations, which by the way are useful as long as they don't want to
impose their views and practices in an exclusive way.

And more importantly there is room for everyone in OSM.

On cost effectiveness, granted (if you live in a country where tax
rebates of the kind apply, and if the charity you whish to donate to is
properly registered by the gov. of the country you live in... Common in
N. America and Europe, but don't assume this is the case everywhere).

However this $45 difference you're claiming is the cost of independence.
Yes, there are people who value independence this much.
There are people who feel better off if they don't have this impression
they owe something to an organisation (and a country, per their tax
incentive).

OSM can and does accommodate various practices, and this is fine. Let's
respect this diversity. Let's respect local OSM communities and chapters.

And let's not replay in OSM what many of us had to endure (and still
endure) for years in HOT.

Regards,

Rod

PS: Below the answer to Mikel's comment on Ulule. As his offer was
broadcasted on twitter and elsewhere my answer (on behalf of OSM Benin)
I think this should be too.






Hi Mikel, and thank you for your offer.

however, rearding your suggestions to use the funds differently:
- OSM Benin (like OSM Mali, OSM Senegal, OSM Togo, OSM Burkina Faso, OSM
Niger...) has already been organising mapping parties for a while
without having to turn to crowd-funding.
And OSM Benin, together with other West-African OSM communities intend
to carry on this way as much as possible.
- Donors so far have contributed for us to get imagery, not fuel. They'd
probably not understand such a change.

Now if Mapbox can update imagery this easily there are so many other
areas which need proper imagery in Benin alone.
Maybe Mapbox and you can better help by providing high resolution open
imagery for other areas such as
- Grand-Popo, West and South,
- Houéyogbé,
- Athiémé-Lokossa, East,
- Dogbo, SE,
- Toucountouna,
- Allada,
- Tori-Bossito,
- Zogbodomey, W,
- Za-Kpota,
- Paougnan,
- Dassa-Zoumè,
- Djabata,
- Ketou, E,
- Pobè,
- Adja-Ouèrè,
- Sakété, E,
- Bamounin, S,
- Tobré, NE,
- Kérou, E,
- Nassoukou,
- Nioro, E...
For a better account of imagery-deprived areas, You may have a look at
Bing maps, and play a bit with zoom levels. Of course if this helps we
can work on providing you with a corresponding geojson file.

Please let us know if you'd like to contribute this way,

Rod on behalf of OSM Bénin




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