Map use without attribution

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Map use without attribution

David Wales
Hi Talk-AU,

I've just noticed some OSM tiles which are being used without attribution.
https://www.westernsydney.edu.au/future/our-campuses/liverpool-city-campus.html

Here is the same location in OSM:
https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Liverpool%2C%20nsw#map=17/-33.92121/150.92614

Is this substantial enough to be worth contacting the website owner?

Relevant links:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Lacking_proper_attribution
https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Licence/Community_Guidelines/Substantial_-_Guideline

Regards,
David Wales



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Re: Map use without attribution

Andrew Harvey-3
Yes, I think they should be attributing OSM per the license, I think it's fair if you want to contact and just remind them of their obligation to provide attribution under the license.

On Wed, 24 Jul 2019 at 20:01, David Wales <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Talk-AU,

I've just noticed some OSM tiles which are being used without attribution.
https://www.westernsydney.edu.au/future/our-campuses/liverpool-city-campus.html

Here is the same location in OSM:
https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Liverpool%2C%20nsw#map=17/-33.92121/150.92614

Is this substantial enough to be worth contacting the website owner?

Relevant links:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Lacking_proper_attribution
https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Licence/Community_Guidelines/Substantial_-_Guideline

Regards,
David Wales


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Re: Map use without attribution

Phil Wyatt
In reply to this post by David Wales
Hi David,

Definitely looks like Open Street map so it can't hurt to contact them as well as add it to that listing of improperly attributed sites

https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=17/-33.92006/150.92683 

Cheers - Phil

-----Original Message-----
From: David Wales [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 24 July 2019 7:58 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [talk-au] Map use without attribution

Hi Talk-AU,

I've just noticed some OSM tiles which are being used without attribution.
https://www.westernsydney.edu.au/future/our-campuses/liverpool-city-campus.html

Here is the same location in OSM:
https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Liverpool%2C%20nsw#map=17/-33.92121/150.92614

Is this substantial enough to be worth contacting the website owner?

Relevant links:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Lacking_proper_attribution
https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Licence/Community_Guidelines/Substantial_-_Guideline

Regards,
David Wales




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Re: Map use without attribution

Kim Oldfield
In reply to this post by David Wales
This looks like a serious attribution error.

The attribution link is to Google maps. Clicking on "Terms of Use" in the bottom right corner of the map takes you to https://www.google.com/intl/en-US_US/help/terms_maps.html

The map tiles are coming from tile.openstreetmap.org

On 24/7/19 7:57 pm, David Wales wrote:
Hi Talk-AU,

I've just noticed some OSM tiles which are being used without attribution.
https://www.westernsydney.edu.au/future/our-campuses/liverpool-city-campus.html

Here is the same location in OSM:
https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Liverpool%2C%20nsw#map=17/-33.92121/150.92614

Is this substantial enough to be worth contacting the website owner?

Relevant links:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Lacking_proper_attribution
https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Licence/Community_Guidelines/Substantial_-_Guideline

Regards,
David Wales



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Re: Map use without attribution

Graeme Fitzpatrick
OT to this particular problem, but still sort of on this subject ...

One of the aircraft tracking sites I use  http://aussieadsb.com/VirtualRadar/desktop.html# has mentioned in this last week that they have changed their background from Google Maps to OSM, as, due to much increased use of their site while Ex Talisman Sabre is on, they had passed their allowed limit for use of Google Maps (28000 /  month) & it was now going to cost them $3000 / month !

Is there any established "marketing / advertising" link to push OSM for similar sites / groups?

& yes, they have attributed us correctly! :-)
 
Thanks

Graeme

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Re: Map use without attribution

Sebastian S.
Hi Gream,
I've been thinking the same back when Google upped their prices.

This is what I understand and I'm happy to be corrected.

OSM (and their infrastructure) is not intended to be used as tile server for (commercial?) Tile consumers. If you search for it OSM has in the past disabled access to load hungry tile consumers, think apps etc.

The idea is that osm provides the data. Tile consumers should either engage with a 3rd party that provides tiles (e.g. geofabrik or MapQuest or...) Or set up their own tile renderer.


--
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

On 25 July 2019 8:30:27 am AEST, Graeme Fitzpatrick <[hidden email]> wrote:
OT to this particular problem, but still sort of on this subject ...

One of the aircraft tracking sites I use  http://aussieadsb.com/VirtualRadar/desktop.html# has mentioned in this last week that they have changed their background from Google Maps to OSM, as, due to much increased use of their site while Ex Talisman Sabre is on, they had passed their allowed limit for use of Google Maps (28000 /  month) & it was now going to cost them $3000 / month !

Is there any established "marketing / advertising" link to push OSM for similar sites / groups?

& yes, they have attributed us correctly! :-)
 
Thanks

Graeme

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Re: Map use without attribution

cameron
We have https://switch2osm.org/ which details how to use OSM in place of Google maps. In terms of the OP and the incorrect attribution, what I assume has happened is that after Google's pricing change they just switched out the image source in their existing map embed for tiles.osm... resulting in what we see.

https://operations.osmfoundation.org/policies/tiles/ is OSMs tile policy. My general understanding has always been that for small/low traffic things using tiles.osm is fine, but for anything that will send significant traffic to the tile CDN is probably better off using a proper tile service.

(Apologies if something goes weird with this message, I've never sent to a mailing list before)

From: "Sebastian S." <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thursday, 25 July 2019 12:31 pm
To: [hidden email]; Graeme Fitzpatrick; Kim Oldfield
Cc: OSM-Au
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Map use without attribution

Hi Gream,
I've been thinking the same back when Google upped their prices.

This is what I understand and I'm happy to be corrected.

OSM (and their infrastructure) is not intended to be used as tile server for (commercial?) Tile consumers. If you search for it OSM has in the past disabled access to load hungry tile consumers, think apps etc.

The idea is that osm provides the data. Tile consumers should either engage with a 3rd party that provides tiles (e.g. geofabrik or MapQuest or...) Or set up their own tile renderer.


--
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

On 25 July 2019 8:30:27 am AEST, Graeme Fitzpatrick <graemefitz1@gmail.com> wrote:
OT to this particular problem, but still sort of on this subject ...

One of the aircraft tracking sites I use  http://aussieadsb.com/VirtualRadar/desktop.html# has mentioned in this last week that they have changed their background from Google Maps to OSM, as, due to much increased use of their site while Ex Talisman Sabre is on, they had passed their allowed limit for use of Google Maps (28000 /  month) & it was now going to cost them $3000 / month !

Is there any established "marketing / advertising" link to push OSM for similar sites / groups?

& yes, they have attributed us correctly! :-)
 
Thanks

Graeme

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Re: Map use without attribution

Sebastian S.
I meant to add the link to switch2osm, thanks for that.
PS: Message reads fine.
--
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

On 25 July 2019 12:58:58 pm AEST, [hidden email] wrote:
We have https://switch2osm.org/ which details how to use OSM in place of Google maps. In terms of the OP and the incorrect attribution, what I assume has happened is that after Google's pricing change they just switched out the image source in their existing map embed for tiles.osm... resulting in what we see.

https://operations.osmfoundation.org/policies/tiles/ is OSMs tile policy. My general understanding has always been that for small/low traffic things using tiles.osm is fine, but for anything that will send significant traffic to the tile CDN is probably better off using a proper tile service.

(Apologies if something goes weird with this message, I've never sent to a mailing list before)

From: "Sebastian S." <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thursday, 25 July 2019 12:31 pm
To: [hidden email]; Graeme Fitzpatrick; Kim Oldfield
Cc: OSM-Au
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Map use without attribution

Hi Gream,
I've been thinking the same back when Google upped their prices.

This is what I understand and I'm happy to be corrected.

OSM (and their infrastructure) is not intended to be used as tile server for (commercial?) Tile consumers. If you search for it OSM has in the past disabled access to load hungry tile consumers, think apps etc.

The idea is that osm provides the data. Tile consumers should either engage with a 3rd party that provides tiles (e.g. geofabrik or MapQuest or...) Or set up their own tile renderer.


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Re: Map use without attribution

SimonPoole
In reply to this post by Graeme Fitzpatrick

Sebastian has already pointed to the switch2osm site.

But a general remark: if it was uneconomical for google to provide such services as their previous price level or for free, there is no magic wand waving that will make it economical for the OSMF to do it for free, or even for the commercial providers in OSMspace.

As a consequence I would try -not- to argue with costs when promoting OSM.

Simon

Am 25.07.2019 um 00:30 schrieb Graeme Fitzpatrick:
OT to this particular problem, but still sort of on this subject ...

One of the aircraft tracking sites I use  http://aussieadsb.com/VirtualRadar/desktop.html# has mentioned in this last week that they have changed their background from Google Maps to OSM, as, due to much increased use of their site while Ex Talisman Sabre is on, they had passed their allowed limit for use of Google Maps (28000 /  month) & it was now going to cost them $3000 / month !

Is there any established "marketing / advertising" link to push OSM for similar sites / groups?

& yes, they have attributed us correctly! :-)
 
Thanks

Graeme

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Re: Map use without attribution

Mateusz Konieczny-3
25 Jul 2019, 11:34 by [hidden email]:

But a general remark: if it was uneconomical for google to provide such services as their previous price level or for free, there is no magic wand waving that will make it economical for the OSMF to do it for free, or even for the commercial providers in OSMspace. 

Note that Google needs to cover costs of
both hosting and data collection.

It is possible that data collection costs
are significant part.

It is also possible that companies providing
OSM services may accept lower profits.

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