OSNI Open Data

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OSNI Open Data

Colin Smale

Has anyone investigated if the data covering Northern Ireland which OSNI make available under OGL V3, is licence-compatible with OSM in the same way as the OSGB open data? I am particularly interested in admin boundaries, e.g. http://osni-spatial-ni.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/a55726475f1b460c927d1816ffde6c72_2

The website says: "Open Government Data Licence applies.    Land & Property Services (LPS) has made a number of Ordnance Survey of Northern Ireland® (OSNI®) branded datasets available free of charge under the terms of the current Open Government Licence (OGL). These datasets – which include raster and vector mapping, boundary, gazetteer, height, street and townland products – are available for download.  Each dataset is clearly marked with the OGL symbol. The OGL allows you to: copy, distribute and transmit the data; adapt the data; and exploit the data commercially, whether by sub-licensing it, combining it with other data, or including it in your own product or application. You are therefore able to use the LPS datasets in any way and for any purpose. We simply ask that you acknowledge the copyright and the source of the data by including the following attribution statement: Contains LPS Intellectual Property © Crown copyright and database right (year)  This information is licensed under the terms of the Open Government Licence (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3). You must also: include the same acknowledgement requirement in any sub-licences of the data that you grant, and a requirement that any further sub-licences do the same; ensure that you do not use the data in a way that suggests LPS endorses you or your use of the data; and make sure you do not misrepresent the data or its source. N.B. Any dataset that does not expressly state that it has been released under OGL will require a licence from LPS and the appropriate licence fee will be applied."




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Re: OSNI Open Data

sk53.osm
This query would actually be better directed at talk-ie as the Irish OSM local chapter have been having discussions with OSNI (and OSI).

However, I think it's safe to say that the relevant licence is not (yet) compatible with OSM: I did briefly discuss this point with one of the Open Data NI people who organised OpenData Camp #5 in Belfast, and she was certainly of the view that OSNI data (or any LPS data) was not very open. Many of these datasets would be very useful, for instance there is a point data set of streetnames (e.g., when the name of this bit of street was being questioned, or just to do streetnames which are perhaps 10% completed).

It is for this reason why there are no local authority boundaries in NI. However, at some point I used FHRS data to produce concave hulls which would be a first approximation (and no worse than things like the Limerick boundary 3-4 years ago). Also KDDA has some open data for the old Fermanagh district  (on umap here) which may assist in working out the boundaries (as will townland and other boundaries). But do check with talk-ie before leaping in.

At one point maps.openstreetmap.ie had a number of overlay layers sourced from the OSI/OSNI data, but I think these never got restored after the server move. I used OSNI townland boundaries to compare with OSM ones back in 2015.

Jerry

On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 18:42, Colin Smale <[hidden email]> wrote:

Has anyone investigated if the data covering Northern Ireland which OSNI make available under OGL V3, is licence-compatible with OSM in the same way as the OSGB open data? I am particularly interested in admin boundaries, e.g. http://osni-spatial-ni.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/a55726475f1b460c927d1816ffde6c72_2

The website says: "Open Government Data Licence applies.    Land & Property Services (LPS) has made a number of Ordnance Survey of Northern Ireland® (OSNI®) branded datasets available free of charge under the terms of the current Open Government Licence (OGL). These datasets – which include raster and vector mapping, boundary, gazetteer, height, street and townland products – are available for download.  Each dataset is clearly marked with the OGL symbol. The OGL allows you to: copy, distribute and transmit the data; adapt the data; and exploit the data commercially, whether by sub-licensing it, combining it with other data, or including it in your own product or application. You are therefore able to use the LPS datasets in any way and for any purpose. We simply ask that you acknowledge the copyright and the source of the data by including the following attribution statement: Contains LPS Intellectual Property © Crown copyright and database right (year)  This information is licensed under the terms of the Open Government Licence (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3). You must also: include the same acknowledgement requirement in any sub-licences of the data that you grant, and a requirement that any further sub-licences do the same; ensure that you do not use the data in a way that suggests LPS endorses you or your use of the data; and make sure you do not misrepresent the data or its source. N.B. Any dataset that does not expressly state that it has been released under OGL will require a licence from LPS and the appropriate licence fee will be applied."



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Re: OSNI Open Data

Colin Smale

Thanks Jerry, I had forgotten that NI comes under Ireland ;-)

I will have a browse through the talk-ie archives and see if I can pick it up there.

Colin

 


On 2019-08-20 22:15, SK53 wrote:

This query would actually be better directed at talk-ie as the Irish OSM local chapter have been having discussions with OSNI (and OSI).
 
However, I think it's safe to say that the relevant licence is not (yet) compatible with OSM: I did briefly discuss this point with one of the Open Data NI people who organised OpenData Camp #5 in Belfast, and she was certainly of the view that OSNI data (or any LPS data) was not very open. Many of these datasets would be very useful, for instance there is a point data set of streetnames (e.g., when the name of this bit of street was being questioned, or just to do streetnames which are perhaps 10% completed).
 
It is for this reason why there are no local authority boundaries in NI. However, at some point I used FHRS data to produce concave hulls which would be a first approximation (and no worse than things like the Limerick boundary 3-4 years ago). Also KDDA has some open data for the old Fermanagh district  (on umap here) which may assist in working out the boundaries (as will townland and other boundaries). But do check with talk-ie before leaping in.
 
At one point maps.openstreetmap.ie had a number of overlay layers sourced from the OSI/OSNI data, but I think these never got restored after the server move. I used OSNI townland boundaries to compare with OSM ones back in 2015.
 
Jerry

On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 18:42, Colin Smale <[hidden email]> wrote:

Has anyone investigated if the data covering Northern Ireland which OSNI make available under OGL V3, is licence-compatible with OSM in the same way as the OSGB open data? I am particularly interested in admin boundaries, e.g. http://osni-spatial-ni.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/a55726475f1b460c927d1816ffde6c72_2

The website says: "Open Government Data Licence applies.    Land & Property Services (LPS) has made a number of Ordnance Survey of Northern Ireland® (OSNI®) branded datasets available free of charge under the terms of the current Open Government Licence (OGL). These datasets – which include raster and vector mapping, boundary, gazetteer, height, street and townland products – are available for download.  Each dataset is clearly marked with the OGL symbol. The OGL allows you to: copy, distribute and transmit the data; adapt the data; and exploit the data commercially, whether by sub-licensing it, combining it with other data, or including it in your own product or application. You are therefore able to use the LPS datasets in any way and for any purpose. We simply ask that you acknowledge the copyright and the source of the data by including the following attribution statement: Contains LPS Intellectual Property © Crown copyright and database right (year)  This information is licensed under the terms of the Open Government Licence (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3). You must also: include the same acknowledgement requirement in any sub-licences of the data that you grant, and a requirement that any further sub-licences do the same; ensure that you do not use the data in a way that suggests LPS endorses you or your use of the data; and make sure you do not misrepresent the data or its source. N.B. Any dataset that does not expressly state that it has been released under OGL will require a licence from LPS and the appropriate licence fee will be applied."



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Re: OSNI Open Data

Jez Nicholson
Just for the record: NI has the unusual distinction in OSM of coming under the UK and for practical reasons also being discussed under IE.

- Jez

On Tue, 20 Aug 2019, 21:25 Colin Smale, <[hidden email]> wrote:

Thanks Jerry, I had forgotten that NI comes under Ireland ;-)

I will have a browse through the talk-ie archives and see if I can pick it up there.

Colin

 


On 2019-08-20 22:15, SK53 wrote:

This query would actually be better directed at talk-ie as the Irish OSM local chapter have been having discussions with OSNI (and OSI).
 
However, I think it's safe to say that the relevant licence is not (yet) compatible with OSM: I did briefly discuss this point with one of the Open Data NI people who organised OpenData Camp #5 in Belfast, and she was certainly of the view that OSNI data (or any LPS data) was not very open. Many of these datasets would be very useful, for instance there is a point data set of streetnames (e.g., when the name of this bit of street was being questioned, or just to do streetnames which are perhaps 10% completed).
 
It is for this reason why there are no local authority boundaries in NI. However, at some point I used FHRS data to produce concave hulls which would be a first approximation (and no worse than things like the Limerick boundary 3-4 years ago). Also KDDA has some open data for the old Fermanagh district  (on umap here) which may assist in working out the boundaries (as will townland and other boundaries). But do check with talk-ie before leaping in.
 
At one point maps.openstreetmap.ie had a number of overlay layers sourced from the OSI/OSNI data, but I think these never got restored after the server move. I used OSNI townland boundaries to compare with OSM ones back in 2015.
 
Jerry

On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 18:42, Colin Smale <[hidden email]> wrote:

Has anyone investigated if the data covering Northern Ireland which OSNI make available under OGL V3, is licence-compatible with OSM in the same way as the OSGB open data? I am particularly interested in admin boundaries, e.g. http://osni-spatial-ni.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/a55726475f1b460c927d1816ffde6c72_2

The website says: "Open Government Data Licence applies.    Land & Property Services (LPS) has made a number of Ordnance Survey of Northern Ireland® (OSNI®) branded datasets available free of charge under the terms of the current Open Government Licence (OGL). These datasets – which include raster and vector mapping, boundary, gazetteer, height, street and townland products – are available for download.  Each dataset is clearly marked with the OGL symbol. The OGL allows you to: copy, distribute and transmit the data; adapt the data; and exploit the data commercially, whether by sub-licensing it, combining it with other data, or including it in your own product or application. You are therefore able to use the LPS datasets in any way and for any purpose. We simply ask that you acknowledge the copyright and the source of the data by including the following attribution statement: Contains LPS Intellectual Property © Crown copyright and database right (year)  This information is licensed under the terms of the Open Government Licence (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3). You must also: include the same acknowledgement requirement in any sub-licences of the data that you grant, and a requirement that any further sub-licences do the same; ensure that you do not use the data in a way that suggests LPS endorses you or your use of the data; and make sure you do not misrepresent the data or its source. N.B. Any dataset that does not expressly state that it has been released under OGL will require a licence from LPS and the appropriate licence fee will be applied."



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Re: OSNI Open Data

Owen Boswarva
In reply to this post by sk53.osm
OSNI have said in a Twitter discussion today that they will remove the link to the LPS licence, to make it clear that normal OGL terms apply to this data:


If you source the NI administrative boundaries from the Open Data NI site (instead of the OSNI site) it already says the plain OGL applies, e.g. https://www.opendatani.gov.uk/dataset/osni-open-data-largescale-boundaries-county-boundaries1

Owen

On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 21:16, SK53 <[hidden email]> wrote:

This query would actually be better directed at talk-ie as the Irish OSM local chapter have been having discussions with OSNI (and OSI).

However, I think it's safe to say that the relevant licence is not (yet) compatible with OSM: I did briefly discuss this point with one of the Open Data NI people who organised OpenData Camp #5 in Belfast, and she was certainly of the view that OSNI data (or any LPS data) was not very open. Many of these datasets would be very useful, for instance there is a point data set of streetnames (e.g., when the name of this bit of street was being questioned, or just to do streetnames which are perhaps 10% completed).

It is for this reason why there are no local authority boundaries in NI. However, at some point I used FHRS data to produce concave hulls which would be a first approximation (and no worse than things like the Limerick boundary 3-4 years ago). Also KDDA has some open data for the old Fermanagh district  (on umap here) which may assist in working out the boundaries (as will townland and other boundaries). But do check with talk-ie before leaping in.

At one point maps.openstreetmap.ie had a number of overlay layers sourced from the OSI/OSNI data, but I think these never got restored after the server move. I used OSNI townland boundaries to compare with OSM ones back in 2015.

Jerry

On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 18:42, Colin Smale <[hidden email]> wrote:

Has anyone investigated if the data covering Northern Ireland which OSNI make available under OGL V3, is licence-compatible with OSM in the same way as the OSGB open data? I am particularly interested in admin boundaries, e.g. http://osni-spatial-ni.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/a55726475f1b460c927d1816ffde6c72_2

The website says: "Open Government Data Licence applies.    Land & Property Services (LPS) has made a number of Ordnance Survey of Northern Ireland® (OSNI®) branded datasets available free of charge under the terms of the current Open Government Licence (OGL). These datasets – which include raster and vector mapping, boundary, gazetteer, height, street and townland products – are available for download.  Each dataset is clearly marked with the OGL symbol. The OGL allows you to: copy, distribute and transmit the data; adapt the data; and exploit the data commercially, whether by sub-licensing it, combining it with other data, or including it in your own product or application. You are therefore able to use the LPS datasets in any way and for any purpose. We simply ask that you acknowledge the copyright and the source of the data by including the following attribution statement: Contains LPS Intellectual Property © Crown copyright and database right (year)  This information is licensed under the terms of the Open Government Licence (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3). You must also: include the same acknowledgement requirement in any sub-licences of the data that you grant, and a requirement that any further sub-licences do the same; ensure that you do not use the data in a way that suggests LPS endorses you or your use of the data; and make sure you do not misrepresent the data or its source. N.B. Any dataset that does not expressly state that it has been released under OGL will require a licence from LPS and the appropriate licence fee will be applied."



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Re: OSNI Open Data

Colin Smale

That sounds like great news, Owen. Thanks for your help!

 

Colin

On 2019-08-21 15:10, Owen Boswarva wrote:

OSNI have said in a Twitter discussion today that they will remove the link to the LPS licence, to make it clear that normal OGL terms apply to this data:
 
 
If you source the NI administrative boundaries from the Open Data NI site (instead of the OSNI site) it already says the plain OGL applies, e.g. https://www.opendatani.gov.uk/dataset/osni-open-data-largescale-boundaries-county-boundaries1
 
Owen

On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 21:16, SK53 <[hidden email]> wrote:
 
This query would actually be better directed at talk-ie as the Irish OSM local chapter have been having discussions with OSNI (and OSI).
 
However, I think it's safe to say that the relevant licence is not (yet) compatible with OSM: I did briefly discuss this point with one of the Open Data NI people who organised OpenData Camp #5 in Belfast, and she was certainly of the view that OSNI data (or any LPS data) was not very open. Many of these datasets would be very useful, for instance there is a point data set of streetnames (e.g., when the name of this bit of street was being questioned, or just to do streetnames which are perhaps 10% completed).
 
It is for this reason why there are no local authority boundaries in NI. However, at some point I used FHRS data to produce concave hulls which would be a first approximation (and no worse than things like the Limerick boundary 3-4 years ago). Also KDDA has some open data for the old Fermanagh district  (on umap here) which may assist in working out the boundaries (as will townland and other boundaries). But do check with talk-ie before leaping in.
 
At one point maps.openstreetmap.ie had a number of overlay layers sourced from the OSI/OSNI data, but I think these never got restored after the server move. I used OSNI townland boundaries to compare with OSM ones back in 2015.
 
Jerry

On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 18:42, Colin Smale <[hidden email]> wrote:

Has anyone investigated if the data covering Northern Ireland which OSNI make available under OGL V3, is licence-compatible with OSM in the same way as the OSGB open data? I am particularly interested in admin boundaries, e.g. http://osni-spatial-ni.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/a55726475f1b460c927d1816ffde6c72_2

The website says: "Open Government Data Licence applies.    Land & Property Services (LPS) has made a number of Ordnance Survey of Northern Ireland® (OSNI®) branded datasets available free of charge under the terms of the current Open Government Licence (OGL). These datasets – which include raster and vector mapping, boundary, gazetteer, height, street and townland products – are available for download.  Each dataset is clearly marked with the OGL symbol. The OGL allows you to: copy, distribute and transmit the data; adapt the data; and exploit the data commercially, whether by sub-licensing it, combining it with other data, or including it in your own product or application. You are therefore able to use the LPS datasets in any way and for any purpose. We simply ask that you acknowledge the copyright and the source of the data by including the following attribution statement: Contains LPS Intellectual Property © Crown copyright and database right (year)  This information is licensed under the terms of the Open Government Licence (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3). You must also: include the same acknowledgement requirement in any sub-licences of the data that you grant, and a requirement that any further sub-licences do the same; ensure that you do not use the data in a way that suggests LPS endorses you or your use of the data; and make sure you do not misrepresent the data or its source. N.B. Any dataset that does not expressly state that it has been released under OGL will require a licence from LPS and the appropriate licence fee will be applied."



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