What is the meaning of hgv:national_network=yes/terminal_access?

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What is the meaning of hgv:national_network=yes/terminal_access?

Joseph Eisenberg
I've found this undocumented tag, used 130,000 times, almost
exclusively in the USA.

https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/hgv%3Anational_network#overview

Values: yes 86.56%   terminal_access 13.37%

I thought it might be imported from Tiger, but the usage has increased
gradually since 2012: 60k more ways have been tagged in that time.

How are these tags being used?

I'm guessing that hgv:national_network=yes means that a road is
designated for heavy trucks to use for long-distance trips.

Perhaps hgv:national_network=terminal_access means that heavy trucks
can only use a road if their destination is on it, or near it?

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Re: What is the meaning of hgv:national_network=yes/terminal_access?

Mike N.

This was part of the iterative road improvement after TIGER as we began
with major highways.    I believe it came from the public domain
information for the National Network
https://ops.fhwa.dot.gov/freight/infrastructure/national_network.htm .

On 8/4/2019 10:56 AM, Joseph Eisenberg wrote:

> I've found this undocumented tag, used 130,000 times, almost
> exclusively in the USA.
>
> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/hgv%3Anational_network#overview
>
> Values: yes 86.56%   terminal_access 13.37%
>
> I thought it might be imported from Tiger, but the usage has increased
> gradually since 2012: 60k more ways have been tagged in that time.
>
> How are these tags being used?
>
> I'm guessing that hgv:national_network=yes means that a road is
> designated for heavy trucks to use for long-distance trips.
>
> Perhaps hgv:national_network=terminal_access means that heavy trucks
> can only use a road if their destination is on it, or near it?
>
> _______________________________________________
> Talk-us mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
>


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Re: What is the meaning of hgv:national_network=yes/terminal_access?

Joseph Eisenberg
hgv:national_network=terminal_access means > "a road which can carry
cargo trucks and has an adequate turn-around facility at the end"

Great, that's helpful. So it sounds like this tag is a synonym for
hgv=destination or hgv=yes?

Joseph

On 8/5/19, Mike N <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi, "Terminal Access" appears to be unique to California, and generally
> means a road which can carry cargo trucks and has an adequate
> turn-around facility at the end.   They most often provide access for
> cargo pick-up or delivery.   (at least one area says it does not include
> oversize trucks)
>
>    Regards,
>
>    Mike Nice
>
> On 8/5/2019 6:33 AM, Joseph Eisenberg wrote:
>> Ok, thanks! I've created a wiki page at Key:hgv:national_network
>>
>> It's still not clear to me what the tag
>> hgv:national_network=terminal_access means - please add if you can
>> tell from the data in your area, perhaps?
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 5, 2019 at 1:13 AM Mike N <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> This was part of the iterative road improvement after TIGER as we began
>>> with major highways.?? ?? I believe it came from the public domain
>>> information for the National Network
>>> https://ops.fhwa.dot.gov/freight/infrastructure/national_network.htm .
>>>
>>> On 8/4/2019 10:56 AM, Joseph Eisenberg wrote:
>>>> I've found this undocumented tag, used 130,000 times, almost
>>>> exclusively in the USA.
>>>>
>>>> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/hgv%3Anational_network#overview
>>>>
>>>> Values: yes 86.56%?? ??terminal_access 13.37%
>>>>
>>>> I thought it might be imported from Tiger, but the usage has increased
>>>> gradually since 2012: 60k more ways have been tagged in that time.
>>>>
>>>> How are these tags being used?
>>>>
>>>> I'm guessing that hgv:national_network=yes means that a road is
>>>> designated for heavy trucks to use for long-distance trips.
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps hgv:national_network=terminal_access means that heavy trucks
>>>> can only use a road if their destination is on it, or near it?
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Talk-us mailing list
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Talk-us mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
>>
>
>

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Re: What is the meaning of hgv:national_network=yes/terminal_access?

Mike N.
hgv=destination is the closest, but I'm not exactly sure how routers
treat 'destination'.   Some of these look like they carry some 'through
traffic' in addition to the classic termination at a facility.


On 8/5/2019 9:07 AM, Joseph Eisenberg wrote:

> hgv:national_network=terminal_access means > "a road which can carry
> cargo trucks and has an adequate turn-around facility at the end"
>
> Great, that's helpful. So it sounds like this tag is a synonym for
> hgv=destination or hgv=yes?
>
> Joseph
>
> On 8/5/19, Mike N <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Hi, "Terminal Access" appears to be unique to California, and generally
>> means a road which can carry cargo trucks and has an adequate
>> turn-around facility at the end.   They most often provide access for
>> cargo pick-up or delivery.   (at least one area says it does not include
>> oversize trucks)
>>
>>     Regards,
>>
>>     Mike Nice
>>
>> On 8/5/2019 6:33 AM, Joseph Eisenberg wrote:
>>> Ok, thanks! I've created a wiki page at Key:hgv:national_network
>>>
>>> It's still not clear to me what the tag
>>> hgv:national_network=terminal_access means - please add if you can
>>> tell from the data in your area, perhaps?
>>>
>>> Joseph
>>>
>>> On Mon, Aug 5, 2019 at 1:13 AM Mike N <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> This was part of the iterative road improvement after TIGER as we began
>>>> with major highways.?? ?? I believe it came from the public domain
>>>> information for the National Network
>>>> https://ops.fhwa.dot.gov/freight/infrastructure/national_network.htm .
>>>>
>>>> On 8/4/2019 10:56 AM, Joseph Eisenberg wrote:
>>>>> I've found this undocumented tag, used 130,000 times, almost
>>>>> exclusively in the USA.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/hgv%3Anational_network#overview
>>>>>
>>>>> Values: yes 86.56%?? ??terminal_access 13.37%
>>>>>
>>>>> I thought it might be imported from Tiger, but the usage has increased
>>>>> gradually since 2012: 60k more ways have been tagged in that time.
>>>>>
>>>>> How are these tags being used?
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm guessing that hgv:national_network=yes means that a road is
>>>>> designated for heavy trucks to use for long-distance trips.
>>>>>
>>>>> Perhaps hgv:national_network=terminal_access means that heavy trucks
>>>>> can only use a road if their destination is on it, or near it?
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Talk-us mailing list
>>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Talk-us mailing list
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
>>>
>>
>>
>


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Re: What is the meaning of hgv:national_network=yes/terminal_access?

Bill Ricker
So is this the tag the lack of which should keep trucks off my street with tight turn radii?

On Mon, Aug 5, 2019, 9:38 AM Mike N <[hidden email]> wrote:
hgv=destination is the closest, but I'm not exactly sure how routers
treat 'destination'.   Some of these look like they carry some 'through
traffic' in addition to the classic termination at a facility.


On 8/5/2019 9:07 AM, Joseph Eisenberg wrote:
> hgv:national_network=terminal_access means > "a road which can carry
> cargo trucks and has an adequate turn-around facility at the end"
>
> Great, that's helpful. So it sounds like this tag is a synonym for
> hgv=destination or hgv=yes?
>
> Joseph
>
> On 8/5/19, Mike N <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Hi, "Terminal Access" appears to be unique to California, and generally
>> means a road which can carry cargo trucks and has an adequate
>> turn-around facility at the end.   They most often provide access for
>> cargo pick-up or delivery.   (at least one area says it does not include
>> oversize trucks)
>>
>>     Regards,
>>
>>     Mike Nice
>>
>> On 8/5/2019 6:33 AM, Joseph Eisenberg wrote:
>>> Ok, thanks! I've created a wiki page at Key:hgv:national_network
>>>
>>> It's still not clear to me what the tag
>>> hgv:national_network=terminal_access means - please add if you can
>>> tell from the data in your area, perhaps?
>>>
>>> Joseph
>>>
>>> On Mon, Aug 5, 2019 at 1:13 AM Mike N <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> This was part of the iterative road improvement after TIGER as we began
>>>> with major highways.?? ?? I believe it came from the public domain
>>>> information for the National Network
>>>> https://ops.fhwa.dot.gov/freight/infrastructure/national_network.htm .
>>>>
>>>> On 8/4/2019 10:56 AM, Joseph Eisenberg wrote:
>>>>> I've found this undocumented tag, used 130,000 times, almost
>>>>> exclusively in the USA.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/hgv%3Anational_network#overview
>>>>>
>>>>> Values: yes 86.56%?? ??terminal_access 13.37%
>>>>>
>>>>> I thought it might be imported from Tiger, but the usage has increased
>>>>> gradually since 2012: 60k more ways have been tagged in that time.
>>>>>
>>>>> How are these tags being used?
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm guessing that hgv:national_network=yes means that a road is
>>>>> designated for heavy trucks to use for long-distance trips.
>>>>>
>>>>> Perhaps hgv:national_network=terminal_access means that heavy trucks
>>>>> can only use a road if their destination is on it, or near it?
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Talk-us mailing list
>>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Talk-us mailing list
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
>>>
>>
>>
>


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Re: What is the meaning of hgv:national_network=yes/terminal_access?

Mike N.
On 8/5/2019 9:42 AM, Bill Ricker wrote:
> So is this the tag the lack of which should keep trucks off my street
> with tight turn radii?

  I'm not an expert, but I'd guess it only keeps the street from seeing
continuous truck traffic even if it is the best route or turnaround (but
only in California).

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Re: What is the meaning of hgv:national_network=yes/terminal_access?

USA mailing list
In reply to this post by Joseph Eisenberg
On 2019-08-04 7:56 a.m., Joseph Eisenberg wrote:
> I've found this undocumented tag, used 130,000 times, almost
> exclusively in the USA.
>
> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/hgv%3Anational_network#overview
>
> Values: yes 86.56%   terminal_access 13.37%
>
> I thought it might be imported from Tiger, but the usage has increased
> gradually since 2012: 60k more ways have been tagged in that time.

If you look at the length, it increased to 100000 km in Nov 2011, and to
132000 km in Nov 2012. Aside from those sudden increases, there has been
no change in usage.

> How are these tags being used?

They're not.

> I'm guessing that hgv:national_network=yes means that a road is
> designated for heavy trucks to use for long-distance trips.

It means that it has a particular designation for budget purposes with a
department of the federal government.

If I'm recalling correctly, these tags were invented by NE2 and never
subject to any discussion, no data consumers use them, and they are
poorly documented.

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Re: What is the meaning of hgv:national_network=yes/terminal_access?

Joseph Eisenberg
Thank you, that suggests that the apparent increase in usage since
2012 is due to splitting existing ways. I'll mention this on the wiki
page, since it's not something you can see in the Taginfo numbers.

On 8/6/19, Paul Norman via Talk-us <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 2019-08-04 7:56 a.m., Joseph Eisenberg wrote:
>> I've found this undocumented tag, used 130,000 times, almost
>> exclusively in the USA.
>>
>> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/hgv%3Anational_network#overview
>>
>> Values: yes 86.56%   terminal_access 13.37%
>>
>> I thought it might be imported from Tiger, but the usage has increased
>> gradually since 2012: 60k more ways have been tagged in that time.
>
> If you look at the length, it increased to 100000 km in Nov 2011, and to
> 132000 km in Nov 2012. Aside from those sudden increases, there has been
> no change in usage.
>
>> How are these tags being used?
>
> They're not.
>
>> I'm guessing that hgv:national_network=yes means that a road is
>> designated for heavy trucks to use for long-distance trips.
>
> It means that it has a particular designation for budget purposes with a
> department of the federal government.
>
> If I'm recalling correctly, these tags were invented by NE2 and never
> subject to any discussion, no data consumers use them, and they are
> poorly documented.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Talk-us mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
>

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Re: What is the meaning of hgv:national_network=yes/terminal_access?

Paul Johnson-3
In reply to this post by Joseph Eisenberg


On Mon, Aug 5, 2019 at 8:07 AM Joseph Eisenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:
hgv:national_network=terminal_access means > "a road which can carry
cargo trucks and has an adequate turn-around facility at the end"

Great, that's helpful. So it sounds like this tag is a synonym for
hgv=destination or hgv=yes?

Well, I'd say more like hgv=designated 

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